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One Love
Registered Member
Date Joined Jan 2003
Total Posts : 13888
| Posted 8/1/2008 5:00 PM (GMT -6) |   | | Good ol Wiki
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Relation of the Soul to God
The unqualified Deity, the Trinity (birth of the Son or of the Eternal Word), and the creation of the world are to him three immediate moments, which follow each other in conceptual, not temporal sequence. All creatures have part in the divine essence; but this is true of the soul in a higher degree. In the irrational creature there is something of God; but in the soul, God is divine (230, 26; 2,31, 4). Though God speaks his word in all creatures, only rational creatures can preserve it (479, 19). In other words, in the soul, where he has his resting-place, God is subjective, while in the rest of creation he is merely objective. The soul is an image of God, in so far as its chief powers, memory, reason, and will, answer to the divine persons (319, 1). This accords with the view of Augustine. Just as there is the absolute Deity, which is superior to the persons of the Godhead, so in the soul there is something that is superior to its own powers. This is the innermost background of the soul, which Eckhart frequently calls a "spark," or "little spark." In its real nature this basis of the soul is one with the Deity (66, 2). When Eckhart sometimes speaks of it as uncreated (286, 16; 311, 6), and then again as created, this does not involve a contradiction. While, on the one hand, it rests eternally in the Deity; on the other it entered into the temporal existence of the soul, i.e., it was made or created through grace. But it is not in this original unity with God that the soul finds its perfection and bliss. As it has a subjective being, it must turn to God, in order that the essential principle implanted in it may be truly realized. It is not enough that it was made by God; God must come and be in it. But this has taken place without hindrance only in the human soul of Christ (67, 12). For all other souls sin is an obstacle.
Sin and redemption
But wherein does sin consist? Not in the finiteness, which is never removed from the soul (3S7, 3; 500, 1 1), but in the direction of the will toward the finite and its pleasure therein (476, 19; 674, 17). The possibility of sin, however, is based in finiteness, taken together with the free will of the creature. (Tom, wouldn't Hart agree with this idea? ) If it is the destiny of the soul to be the resting-place of God, then the direction of the will toward the finite makes this impossible; and it is this that constitutes sin. Redemption, therefore, can take place only when the creature makes room in his soul for the abstract experience and work of God; and the condition for that is the turning away from the finite. For God is ever ready to work in the soul, provided he is not hindered and the soul is susceptible to his influence (27, 25; 283, 23; 33, 29; 479, 31). The inner separation from everything casual, sensual, earthly and the yielding to the work of God in the heart, that is the seclusion or tranquility of which Eckhart speaks again and again. For him this is the basis of all piety. But what is it that God accomplishes in the soul? The birth of the Son. As the soul is an image of the Deity, if it is to fulfill its destiny, then that process by which the deity develops into the three persons must take place in it. In the soul, the Father procreates the Son (44, 28; 175, 15-20; 479, 10; 13, 12). This takes place during the life of the soul in time; and, too, not merely at a particular moment, but rather continuously and repeatedly. This is not merely a copy or analogon of that inner divine process, but is in truth that very process itself, by which it becomes, through grace, what the Son of God is by nature (433, 32; 382, 7; 377, 17). From this view of Eckhart's follow a number of the most striking statements in which the soul is made to share in the attributes and works of God, including the creation (119, 28-40; 267, 4; 283, 37-284, 7). However, according to Eckhart, a complete fusion of the soul with the Deity never takes place (387, 3). He also opposes the doctrine of Apocatastasis (65, 20; 402, 34; 470, 22).
Place of Christ
According to Eckhart, sin is not the real cause of the incarnation (591, 34). God wished rather to receive the nature of things through grace in time just as he had them by nature in eternity in himself (574, 34). Just as a man occupies a central position in the world, since he leads all creatures back to God, so Christ stands in the center of humanity (180, 7; 390, 37.) The same thought is found in Maximus the Confessor and Johannes Scotus Eriugena, but whence did Eckhart get it? Even at the creation of the first man Christ was already the end in view (250, 23); and now after the fact of sin, Christ stands likewise in the center of redemption. After the fall, all creatures worked together to produce a man who should restore harmony (497, 11). This took place when Mary (The THEOTOKOS) resigned herself so completely to the divine word that the eternal word could assume human nature in her. However, this temporal birth of the son is again included in his eternal birth as a moment of the same (391, 20). And now God is to be born in us. In his human life Jesus becomes a pattern for man; and in all that he did and experienced, above all in his passion and death there is an overwhelming power that draws man to God (218-219) and brings about in us that which first took place in Christ, who alone is the way to the father (241, 17).
See what great love the Father has lavished on us, that we should be called children of God! And that is what we are! The reason the world does not know us is that it did not know him. Dear friends, now we are children of God, and what we will be has not yet been made known. But we know that when Christ appears, we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is. All who have this hope in him purify themselves, just as he is pure.
Blessed are the pure in heart, for they will see God. | | Back to Top | | |
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One Love
Registered Member
Date Joined Jan 2003
Total Posts : 13888
| Posted 8/1/2008 5:14 PM (GMT -6) | | |
To be Orthodox means to have the God-man constantly in your soul, to live in Him, think in Him, feel in Him, act in Him. In other words, to be Orthodox means to be a Christ-bearer and a Spirit-bearer.
A man attains this when, in the body of Christ — the Church, his whole being is filled with the God-man Christ from top to bottom. For this reason the Orthodox man is hidden with Christ in God (Col. 3:1-3).
Archimandrite Justin Popovich
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"...the purpose of the universe is not human beings considered in their natural condition, but unique creatures in whom the Logos is indwelling and who are chosen to transfigure the universe by bringing it to the ultimate union with God."
Alexei Nesteruk. Light from the East. 230.
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As Meister Eckhart teaches, "He who abides always in a present now, in him does God beget his Son without ceasing."
Kallistos Ware, Orthodox Way, 115
See what great love the Father has lavished on us, that we should be called children of God! And that is what we are! The reason the world does not know us is that it did not know him. Dear friends, now we are children of God, and what we will be has not yet been made known. But we know that when Christ appears, we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is. All who have this hope in him purify themselves, just as he is pure.
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One Love
Registered Member
Date Joined Jan 2003
Total Posts : 13888
| Posted 8/1/2008 5:19 PM (GMT -6) | | I just wonder...if as Christians...
we've been setting our bars WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY too low!
See what great love the Father has lavished on us, that we should be called children of God! And that is what we are! The reason the world does not know us is that it did not know him. Dear friends, now we are children of God, and what we will be has not yet been made known. But we know that when Christ appears, we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is. All who have this hope in him purify themselves, just as he is pure.
Blessed are the pure in heart, for they will see God. | | Back to Top | | |
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One Love
Registered Member
Date Joined Jan 2003
Total Posts : 13888
| Posted 8/1/2008 5:25 PM (GMT -6) | | BECOMING LIKE GOD: AN EVANGELICAL DOCTRINE OF THEOSIS
JETS 40/2 (June 1997) 257-269
Robert V. Rakestraw
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The strengths of theosis theology outweigh [the] weaknesses, however. The most significant benefit is that the concept as a whole, if not the specific terminology, is biblical. Pauline teaching supports much that is emphasized by theosis theologians. In 2 Corinthians 3, Paul writes that Christians, "who with unveiled faces all reflect the Lord's glory, are being transformed into his likeness with ever-increasing glory, which comes from the Lord, who is the Spirit" (2 Cor. 3:17-18). The Christian who experiences this transformation develops a remarkable God-given assurance that she is actually thinking the thoughts of God, doing the works of God, and, at times, even speaking the words of God. These energies and ministries of God in the Christian yielded to her Lord are the natural outcome of the life of God in the soul.{49}
In his discourse on wisdom from the Spirit, Paul states that the spiritual person has "the mind of Christ" (1 Cor. 2:16). We learn to think the thoughts of God. We also speak "words taught by the Spirit, expressing spiritual truths in spiritual words" (1 Cor. 2:13; see also 1 Thess. 2:13; 1 Pet. 4:11). What we say in significant moments of teaching, preaching and encouraging can have the quality and effect of God's words themselves. Concerning our doing the works of God, Jesus said that his followers would do greater works than he himself did, because he was going to the Father (Jn. 14:12). Because the ascension of Christ brought the Spirit to earth in increasing measure (Acts 1-2), the Christian may now participate in the acts of the risen Christ by the energy of the indwelling Spirit. Panayiotis Nellas writes:
The real anthropological meaning of deification is Christification. It is no accident that in his Letter to the Colossians, where he hymns Christ as "the image of the invisible God, the first-born of all creation" (Col 1:15), St Paul calls on "every man" to become "mature in Christ" (Col 1:28), and adds that the faithful "have come to fullness of life in Him" (Col. 2:10). When he urges the faithful to show that they are attaining "to mature manhood, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ" (Eph 4:13), and to acquire "the mind of Christ" (1 Cor. 2:16), the heart of Christ (cf. Eph 3:17) and so on, St Paul does not do so for reasons of external piety and sentiment; he speaks ontologically. He is not advocating an external imitation or a simple ethical improvement but a real Christification. For, as St [sic] Maximos says, "God the divine Logos wishes to effect the mystery of His incarnation always and in all things."{50}
The Pauline concept of our being "in Christ" may take on new meaning as we realize more and more our genuine participation in the life and energies of God. Indeed, as we read in John Wesley's favorite preaching text, "it is because of him that you are in Christ Jesus, who has become for us wisdom from God--that is, our righteousness, holiness, and redemption. Therefore, . . . let him who boasts boast in the Lord" (1 Cor. 1:30-31).
Paul also writes that "you died, and your life is now hidden with Christ in God," and speaks of Christ as "your life" (Col. 3:3-4; also Gal. 2:20). He also exhorts us to "put on the new self, created to be like God in true righteousness and holiness" (Eph. 4:24). "For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form, and you have been given fullness in Christ" (Col. 2:9-10). John's great section on our union with Christ as vine and branches (John 15:1-17) has a direct bearing on the topic, as does his teaching that the one born of God has "God's seed" living in him (1 Jn. 3:9). Many other Scriptures relate to the subject.{51} While much exegetical work on these and related texts needs to be done by evangelicals in developing a high view of participation in God, there is a solid scriptural foundation on which to build.
See what great love the Father has lavished on us, that we should be called children of God! And that is what we are! The reason the world does not know us is that it did not know him. Dear friends, now we are children of God, and what we will be has not yet been made known. But we know that when Christ appears, we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is. All who have this hope in him purify themselves, just as he is pure.
Blessed are the pure in heart, for they will see God. Post Edited (Love's Child) : 8/1/2008 6:37:26 PM (GMT-5) | | Back to Top | | |
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One Love
Registered Member
Date Joined Jan 2003
Total Posts : 13888
| Posted 8/1/2008 6:43 PM (GMT -6) | | Tom.
Come ON now, homie.
Christ-the-Logos is the Telos.
See what great love the Father has lavished on us, that we should be called children of God! And that is what we are! The reason the world does not know us is that it did not know him. Dear friends, now we are children of God, and what we will be has not yet been made known. But we know that when Christ appears, we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is. All who have this hope in him purify themselves, just as he is pure.
Blessed are the pure in heart, for they will see God. | | Back to Top | | |
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PotOnWheel
Registered Member
Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 9890
| Posted 8/1/2008 8:19 PM (GMT -6) | | | Starting at the end (trust me?)
Who Is The Theotokos?
A 3 part lecture delivered at the Northern California Antiochian Diocesan Women's Retreat Nov 9-11 2007 at the San Damiano Retreat Center in Danville, CA. We provide the 3 lectures in increments of approximately 30 minutes each.
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One Love
Registered Member
Date Joined Jan 2003
Total Posts : 13888
| Posted 8/2/2008 12:32 AM (GMT -6) | | Hopko quoting...
"...anyone who does not confess Mary as "theotokos" is severed from the Godhead."
Gregory the Theologian
Wowzers.
Here's a cool one...
Hopko on Christ-the-Logos...Lecture 3.3
He who dies in the flesh is God because personally he is God's Son who is divine and that's why we say he's a divine person with a divine nature who then takes on humanity and has a human nature but it's the divine person who enhypostasizes the humanity and then lives out in human flesh.
See what great love the Father has lavished on us, that we should be called children of God! And that is what we are! The reason the world does not know us is that it did not know him. Dear friends, now we are children of God, and what we will be has not yet been made known. But we know that when Christ appears, we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is. All who have this hope in him purify themselves, just as he is pure.
Blessed are the pure in heart, for they will see God. Post Edited (Love's Child) : 8/2/2008 12:45:53 AM (GMT-5) | | Back to Top | | |
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PotOnWheel
Registered Member
Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 9890
| Posted 8/2/2008 8:41 AM (GMT -6) | | I've been sharing those podcasts with a few Reformed folk, and it's tenuous--hundreds of years of reactionary habits.
So, I'm guessing that you didn't give Tom much to go on, Dwayne: the first quote will seem impossible to him, and he may not read the second. (He can't hear the podcast anyways.)
But, beautifully, the second explains the first. Let me try...
1. WHAT is involved in confessing Mary as theotokos?
2. We are called to have Christ born in us, to be in Christ -- to die and rise in Him.
Love's Child said...
Hopko quoting...
"...anyone who does not confess Mary as "theotokos" is severed from the Godhead."
Gregory the Theologian
Wowzers.
Here's a cool one...
Hopko on Christ-the-Logos...Lecture 3.3
He who dies in the flesh is God because personally he is God's Son who is divine and that's why we say he's a divine person with a divine nature who then takes on humanity and has a human nature but it's the divine person who enhypostasizes the humanity and then lives out in human flesh.
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One Love
Registered Member
Date Joined Jan 2003
Total Posts : 13888
| Posted 8/3/2008 1:37 PM (GMT -6) | | REPOST...from another thread.
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Christ is the Truth behind Creation and Salvation. Everything is about Christ. Everything.
I have written recently that the true central question of our relationship with God goes to the very fact of our existence, that “in Him we live and move and have our being.” I have also written some short comments on statements of the Elder Sophrony reminding us that all we do, we do in the presence of God. Both of these bring us to the question of true or authentic existence. I do not wish to look at something around me (or someone) and say “that does not exist.” Such a statement would be both untrue and silly.
But I do want to be able to look at myself (you’re invited into this as well) and distinguish between mere existence and authentic existence. The purpose for which we were and are created is not mere existence. I can think of many days in my life of mere existence and not one of them has had much to recommend it (though I’m grateful to begin even there). But to exist authentically, is to exist not just before and in the presence of God, but consciously present to Him as the very center of my being - as the very center of all that is.
I have become increasingly aware of this during Church services lately. I suppose I could have become aware of it anywhere, and I’m sure that I should be aware of it everywhere. But lately, it has been in the services of the Church that this awareness has opened to me (or me to it). The awareness is simply that at the heart of every word, every action, every sound and movement, God is there. And more than that - but that God is in us, in me, in the midst of all that us. It in no way distracts from words or actions but gives them their proper meaning.
It has brought to my mind the understanding that regardless of what we do at any time, within our heart our attention should be toward God. My directions to those who come to the Church inquiring about the Orthodox faith is not to be distracted by anything, but in all things to seek God. The Orthodox Church exists for no other reason than to unite man to God in Christ. Indeed, the Church is nothing other than the union of God and man in Christ.
This is authentic and true existence - that for which we were and are created: Christ.
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The Heart of Christ is the "King and Center of all hearts."
Christ is the Alpha and the Omega (and everything in between).
Hail to our Brother, Bridegroom, and Co-heir, the King and Archetype...Christ the Logos.
See what great love the Father has lavished on us, that we should be called children of God! And that is what we are! The reason the world does not know us is that it did not know him. Dear friends, now we are children of God, and what we will be has not yet been made known. But we know that when Christ appears, we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is. All who have this hope in him purify themselves, just as he is pure.
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