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One Love
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Date Joined Jan 2003
Total Posts : 13888
  		   Posted 2/12/2009 4:02 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
From this John Piper sermon...
 
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Would You Want to Be in Heaven If God Wasn't There?

Justin Taylor, one our assistants at Desiring God, was riding on the plane with me back from Philadelphia, and the guy next to him got into a conversation about Christ. And the question Justin put to him that bore right to the heart was, "Would you want to be in heaven if God weren't there?" Blew the guy away. He said, "Never even thought about that question."

So I'm closing by asking you, "Would you want to be in heaven if Jesus weren't there?" You could have all the health you wanted. You could have all the relationships with friends you wanted. You could have a clean conscience. You could have your favorite toys and recreation - just no Jesus. Would you want to be there? A woman came forward in our church two weeks ago whose tears were just running down her face. She quoted me that question that I had asked and she said, "Yeah, I would. I would, and I'm scared of myself." She was honest, and we need to be honest.

God is love. Whoever lives in love lives in God, and God in them.

"I love, therefore I am in I Am.  God is my life."

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might-be-don
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Date Joined Jun 2001
Total Posts : 830
  		   Posted 2/12/2009 4:16 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
On a scale of 1..10

1 - Here
2 - Heaven w/o Jesus
10- Heaven w/ Jesus.

2 is better than 1 , but 10 is wayyyy better.

peace, don

The world's perfect, wouldn't change a thing.
 

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Tom
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Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 10353
  		   Posted 2/13/2009 1:49 AM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Piper: So I'm closing by asking you, "Would you want to be in heaven if Jesus weren't there?"

Tom: What's being proposed is in fact impossible. There can be no such heaven, for the presence of God and seeing the face of Christ (1John 3.1ff) constitute heaven.

But if Piper wants to ask me if I'm able to just imagine it for the sake of argument to reveal whether I love Jesus or the 'stuff' of heaven, then no, I don't think I can imagine it either.

T
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One Love
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Date Joined Jan 2003
Total Posts : 13888
  		   Posted 2/13/2009 9:27 AM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Tom:
What's being proposed is in fact impossible. There can be no such heaven, for the presence of God and seeing the face of Christ (1John 3.1ff) constitute heaven.

That's pretty much what I was thinking. The whole scenario ASSUMES a "two-storey" view where Christ-the-Logos can be separated from any created experience, including any "heavenly" reality. Interesting, huh?

God is love. Whoever lives in love lives in God, and God in them.

"I love, therefore I am in I Am.  God is my life."

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Corey
Five with a Four-wing




Date Joined Feb 2003
Total Posts : 1893
  		   Posted 2/13/2009 2:15 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
That was my general thought, too. It's a non-obtainable hypothetical, so it's just not that interesting to me to ponder.

 

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