Open Theism Discussion Board
  HomeLog InRegisterSearch the ForumHelp
   
Open Theism Discussion Board > Public Forums > General Chat > (No Subject)
 
Forum Quick Jump
 
New Topic Post Reply Printable Version
[ << Previous Thread | Next Thread >> | Show Newest Post First ]

One Love
Registered Member




Date Joined Jan 2003
Total Posts : 13888
 
   Posted 5/15/2010 1:41 AM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
http://www.myfoxtwincities.com/dpp/news/minnesota/bethel-university-racism-protest-lil-wayne-blackface-skit-may-14-2010

Barnes said after some students complained they were offended by the skit, the school followed its racial response protocol. But the students at Friday's protest said they're unhappy with the school's response.

"We see stuff like this happen a lot and it gets brushed under the rug," student protester Kyle Dick said.

"Due to the response of what's happened here because of the blackface incident, we are feeling that there are many people who don't understand the systemic racism that does exist at both Bethel and other places," Bethel junior Nina Rasmusen said.

shakehead 


Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me, a sinner.

Back to Top
 

One Love
Registered Member




Date Joined Jan 2003
Total Posts : 13888
 
   Posted 5/15/2010 1:59 AM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Bethel News
Statement from Bethel University Regarding Mr. BU Event
Publication date: May 11, 2010 5:47 p.m.

As has been reported by media outlets, five Bethel University seniors were involved in a skit at the event Mr. BU, which was sponsored by the student group Acting on Aids. During the skit one student used black paint on his face in imitation of the rapper Lil’ Wayne.

“As I stated in chapel on May 5, the incident of racial insensitivity at the Mr. BU event violated Bethel’s biblically rooted core values,” said Bethel President Jay Barnes. “Intentional or not, it hurt members of our community and does not reflect the type of place we are trying to become. I am deeply sorry that this happened, that people were hurt, and that we live in a world where the sin of racism is still prevalent.”

One of Bethel’s seven core values is reconciliation—“honoring the worth and dignity of people from all races and purposely seeking to create a community that reflects the diversity of the Body of Christ.” The incident is serving as a significant launching pad for educating students on history and the cultural impact of blackface specifically, as well as discussion as to how the university can better address issues of reconciliation and diversity in its curriculum.

The university is working with the students involved in the skit as well as those affected by it, although specifics of those interactions with students are not public at any point due to privacy laws. There are also bias incident procedures in place to help guide the institutional response in terms of support and education for the community in the event of such an incident.

The students involved in the incident have apologized to Bethel students and faculty for their actions: “Our intentions were not, by any means, to hurt or offend anyone. However, we realize our skit was offensive and hurtful. We are saddened by the fact that we caused pain and offense to our brothers and sisters. We are taking the appropriate next steps to addressing the issue as a whole and are hoping to learn and move forward from here. Our hope is that we can move towards a stronger awareness in our own lives as well as around campus.”

“There are lessons here in repentance, redemption and growing as ‘image bearers’ of God,” reflected Vice President for Student Life Edee Schulze. “There can be grace for those who were involved as well as for those who were affected. We’re all on a journey of learning together how to live justly and love mercy.”

“As reconcilers, we know that confession is a crucial first element in healing,” said Barnes. “Paul’s counsel to the Galatian Christians was that we should gently and humbly help others onto the right path while being careful not to fall into temptation ourselves. We must harvest the painful lessons from this time to help us reach our goal of becoming an antiracist, reconciling, justice-seeking community where God’s grace is evident in our interactions with each other. This is hard work that we must do together.”

Bethel University is a leader in Christian higher education with approximately 6,400 students from 48 states and 29 countries enrolled in undergraduate, graduate, seminary, and adult education programs. Based in St. Paul, Minn., with additional seminary locations on both coasts, Bethel University offers bachelor’s and advanced degrees in nearly 100 relevant fields.


Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me, a sinner.

Back to Top
 

One Love
Registered Member




Date Joined Jan 2003
Total Posts : 13888
 
   Posted 5/15/2010 2:09 AM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
I wonder if more "diversity training" is the solution. I think what would be more appropriate (but helpful besides) is HUMILITY training. I think about it and my mind says this:

If these young people were truly thinking about being Jesus to the "least of these" and humility before God, would they ever have attempted such a display of poor judgment as to perform BLACKFACE of a Lil Wayne song at a Christian university fundraiser...where your fellow African-American students are going to be present?
 
Really...REEEEEEEALY...think about it.
 

By the mid-20th century, changing attitudes about race and racism effectively ended the prominence of blackface makeup used in performance in the U.S. and elsewhere. It remains in relatively limited use as a theatrical device, mostly outside the U.S., and is more commonly used today as social commentary or satire. Perhaps the most enduring effect of blackface is the precedent it established in the introduction of African American culture to an international audience, albeit through a distorted lens.  Blackface's groundbreaking appropriation, exploitation, and assimilation of African-American culture—as well as the inter-ethnic artistic collaborations that stemmed from it—were but a prologue to the lucrative packaging, marketing, and dissemination of African-American cultural expression and its myriad derivative forms in today's world popular culture.


Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me, a sinner.

Post Edited (One Love) : 5/15/2010 8:48:56 AM (GMT-5)

Back to Top
 

PotOnWheel
Registered Member




Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 9890
 
   Posted 5/15/2010 11:46 AM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Students make mistakes. School is an artificial place (has a safetly net) to make those mistakes and learn from them in a setting where one is not alone nor left merely to one's own resources.


(o)

Post Edited (PotOnWheel) : 5/15/2010 9:00:33 PM (GMT-5)

Back to Top
 

One Love
Registered Member




Date Joined Jan 2003
Total Posts : 13888
 
   Posted 5/15/2010 11:52 AM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Students make mistakes. Schoo is an artificial place (has a safetly net) to make those mistakes and learn from them in a setting where one is not alone nor left merely to one's own resources.

If this were a situation of sexual harrasment and/or assault involving a student, the same standpoint would stand, right?

"Students make mistakes."

Privilege in action.


Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me, a sinner.

Post Edited (One Love) : 5/15/2010 12:03:24 PM (GMT-5)

Back to Top
 

One Love
Registered Member




Date Joined Jan 2003
Total Posts : 13888
 
   Posted 5/15/2010 12:01 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Or let me ask the question this way: When my oldest son grows up and wants to go to college, and say he asks about Bethel...and he asks if it's a "safe place" for people of color...what am I supposed to say to say?


Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me, a sinner.

Back to Top
 

One Love
Registered Member




Date Joined Jan 2003
Total Posts : 13888
 
   Posted 5/15/2010 12:06 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Something else. I can probably bet that Curtiss DeYoung and Karen McKinney are NOT happy about what happened.


Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me, a sinner.

Back to Top
 

PotOnWheel
Registered Member




Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 9890
 
   Posted 5/15/2010 7:56 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
D, I like how you said, "If these young people were truly thinking about being Jesus to the "least of these" and humility before God, would they ever have attempted such a display of poor judgment as to perform..."

I don't think that ANY PLACE is safe. Neither as victom or as actor--both participate in sins. (Just look at the perspective of reconciliation in S.Africa.)

My Bethel son called my wife to talk about it--a good move.


(o)

Post Edited (PotOnWheel) : 5/15/2010 8:02:50 PM (GMT-5)

Back to Top
 

PotOnWheel
Registered Member




Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 9890
 
   Posted 5/15/2010 9:03 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.

FOX -

The costume at the controversy performance was complete with deadlocks and gold teeth, but it was the student's blackface that some objected to the most.

"I think it was boys acting ignorant," Lelia Ellison said. "But its a sign that they're not educated. They don't know. So many people didn't realize that what they did was wrong."


(o)

Back to Top
 

PotOnWheel
Registered Member




Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 9890
 
   Posted 5/15/2010 9:08 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
FOX site response -
He was impersonating someone. Does anyone care that Fred Armisen puts on makeup to make his skin darker to look like President Obama on SNL? No. Was this a stupid idea for a skit? Probably. But it's been blown way out of proportion.


(o)

Back to Top
 

PotOnWheel
Registered Member




Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 9890
 
   Posted 5/15/2010 9:19 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
FOX...
19 hours ago
Personally as a university, Bethel should be supporting both those who are hurt and those who were in the skit. These boys are upstanding guys who are known well among the bethel community. They apologized immediately after they realized what they did was wrong. They apologized profusely. That is all they can do. What do you want from them? Thats all they can do, they can't take back what happened or what was done. Publicly humiliating them is just as wrong as what they did. Yes, the boys needed to know what they did was wrong. I'm not denying that, they needed to be talked to. They also should talk to the students who were offended. This situation did not need to be brought into the paper, radio, or the television. As a professor, Rivera should have known what is proper etiquette of what to disclose to a reporter and public. He should know, anything you say to a reporter will get twisted. No reporter is honest. All they want is dirt and drama. No this is not his fault, however he should have known better to give information to them. False information has been said about Reed Larsen which also makes the situation worse. I am also a student at Bethel, and as another Bethel student said, I am now walking around in fear that anything I say will cause offense to somebody. This has caused so much unneeded separation at this university. This whole situation was handled so poorly. There was NO need for a protest DURING a chapel service that was about reconciliation. Bethel is all about reconciliation, but this has NOT been shown to these boys. What happened to grace? or forgiveness? Some people in the protest are willing to shout around campus their opinion, and thats ok. However, when i was expressing my opinion in a private, quiet conversation I was approached by someone saying I needed to get my facts straight. Also when sitting at a table discussing the matter, we have to sit and whisper about it so no one is offended. So this is telling me, we need to hear your opinion loud and clear but we can not express ours at all. Is that right? No.In the real world you will not be able to have a hissy fit about every little thing said to you, you need to pick your battles. Something that has been done innocently or intentionally is two different things. It is VERY clear that what these boys did was unintentional. Forgive and move on. Not only is this humiliating to these boys by all the publicity but you are also giving Bethel a bad name. This destroys community.

Fact of the matter is the boys have all done everything asked of them WILLINGLY, including missing classes, to help resolve this issue. It's time to let it go and move on.
 


(o)

Post Edited (PotOnWheel) : 5/16/2010 8:49:21 PM (GMT-5)

Back to Top
 

One Love
Registered Member




Date Joined Jan 2003
Total Posts : 13888
 
   Posted 5/16/2010 7:32 AM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Bruce, have you asked any African Americans how they feel about this? Specifically, have you talked to any people of color from Bethel about how they feel about this? Honestly.

I'd bet my last dime that none of the peope who remarked were Black. It DOES make a difference, Bruce. Ask me how I know.


Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me, a sinner.

Back to Top
 

PotOnWheel
Registered Member




Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 9890
 
   Posted 5/16/2010 9:03 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
One Love said... Bruce, have you asked any African Americans how they feel about this? Specifically, have you talked to any people of color from Bethel about how they feel about this? Honestly.
(O) says... I know that it DOES make a difference, D.
 
But, but, but it ALSO makes a difference that (quoting from above)... They apologized immediately after they realized what they did was wrong. They apologized profusely.
 
BOTH 'sides' agree that it was wrong. But reconciliation means moving BEYOND sides, and learning more fully that WE are all in this together.
 
 
 
One Love said... I'd bet my last dime that none of the peope who remarked were Black.
 
(O) says... That's too bad. again, the center is US and the task is RECONCILIATION!
 
 
Pax and Zoe!


(o)

Back to Top
 

BBBCanada
Registered Member




Date Joined Jun 2001
Total Posts : 2763
 
   Posted 6/16/2010 7:12 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
When I was a kid of about 10 years old I went out for Halloween dressed up as a black boxer.  I put a small knitted hat and a house coat on.  Then I put black shoe polish all over my face.  I was proud to be going out as one of my favorite heros that my foster mother and I would watch on Friday Night Fights--boxer Muhammad Ali.  Do you think this had/has some racist overtones?


Brandon
It is the purpose that makes strong the vow, but vows to every purpose must not hold.--A friend.
To love without love is slavery--Mother Teresa

Back to Top
 

BBBCanada
Registered Member




Date Joined Jun 2001
Total Posts : 2763
 
   Posted 6/16/2010 7:16 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
By the way.  My face was practically BURNING OFF because of the shoe polish.  NEVER, EVER, EVER, EVER, EVER put shoe polish on your face! You'll be sooooory!


Brandon
It is the purpose that makes strong the vow, but vows to every purpose must not hold.--A friend.
To love without love is slavery--Mother Teresa

Back to Top
 

One Love
Registered Member




Date Joined Jan 2003
Total Posts : 13888
 
   Posted 6/17/2010 9:45 AM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Brandon:
When I was a kid of about 10 years old I went out for Halloween dressed up as a black boxer. I put a small knitted hat and a house coat on. Then I put black shoe polish all over my face. I was proud to be going out as one of my favorite heros that my foster mother and I would watch on Friday Night Fights--boxer Muhammad Ali. Do you think this had/has some racist overtones?


Insofar as your decision (and parents' allowance) was influenced by ignorance (no pejoration here!) supported by a system of power involving people groups, yes. It's the same way with the Bethel students. Insofar as their decision was based on a serious amount ignorance about our society in general, and the history of blackface in particular, it has definite racist overtones.

Please remember that racism is NOT merely about intentional personal descrimination or malice towards certain people groups. It's about power structures and systems that keep privileged people of a racialized society in the dark about some of it's actions.

Feel me, B?


Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me, a sinner.

Back to Top
 

BBBCanada
Registered Member




Date Joined Jun 2001
Total Posts : 2763
 
   Posted 6/17/2010 11:40 AM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
D:  "Insofar as your decision (and parents' allowance) was influenced by ignorance (no pejoration here!) supported by a system of power involving people groups, yes."
 
Brandon:  How did my action involve people groups?  Was I saying that blacks make great prize fighters, like, blacks are great basketball players?  I can see racist overtones in that.  But mine was simply wanting to dress up as my hero. Admittedly, it seems that part of the problem with sports these days is that blacks are patronized when they excel in sports.  I think this could be a form of racism in itself.
 
Also, what do you think of this video, especially the puppet:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Om4eqmF1hlM
 
 
 


Brandon
It is the purpose that makes strong the vow, but vows to every purpose must not hold.--A friend.
To love without love is slavery--Mother Teresa

Back to Top
 

BBBCanada
Registered Member




Date Joined Jun 2001
Total Posts : 2763
 
   Posted 6/17/2010 12:25 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Hmmm...http://www.imdb.com/media/rm2796394240/tt0942385


Brandon
It is the purpose that makes strong the vow, but vows to every purpose must not hold.--A friend.
To love without love is slavery--Mother Teresa

Back to Top
 

PotOnWheel
Registered Member




Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 9890
 
   Posted 6/17/2010 10:42 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
BETHEL/Schulze;  "There can be grace for those who were involved as well as for those who were affected. We're all on a journey of learning together how to live justly and love mercy." (p.9)



(o)

Back to Top
 

PotOnWheel
Registered Member




Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 9890
 
   Posted 6/17/2010 10:45 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
justice for those affected

mercy for those involved

grace


(o)

Back to Top
 

One Love
Registered Member




Date Joined Jan 2003
Total Posts : 13888
 
   Posted 6/18/2010 12:23 AM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
"Where sin abounds, Grace much more abounds." (Mercy for those involved)

"Go and sin no more." (Justice for those affected)


Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me, a sinner.

Back to Top
 

PotOnWheel
Registered Member




Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 9890
 
   Posted 6/18/2010 12:57 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.

I'm note sure you got that. They are parallel: it is not justice from man and mercy from God. Mercy must also come from men--just as justice must; and justice wil be hard to so, as mercy wil be hard.

Clear?


(o)

Back to Top
 
New Topic Post Reply Printable Version
   
Forum Information
Currently it is Monday, November 09, 2026 2:13 PM (GMT -6)
There are a total of 97,718 posts in 6,040 threads.
In the last 3 days there were 0 new threads and 0 reply posts. View Active Threads