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Tigress
Registered Member

Date Joined Feb 2003
Total Posts : 1252

Posted 10/31/2005 5:57 PM (GMT -6)

Hi All,

It's been a long, long time since I've logged onto this site. I don't know if any of you will even remember me. I lost my job 3 days after my cat died in March and I pretty much stopped writing on here because I don't have web access at home. I'm at the library right now.

I started temping at a place downtown two weeks ago, so I'm earning my keep again for now. I'm not going to get another cat until I get a permanent postition somewhere.

Anyway, I was wondering last night about romantic love and the Bible. I've been really down lately about this guy that I like, who doesn't seem to like me back, and I realized that the Bible really doesn't address the issue of romantic love and a broken heart. (I wished to be able to seek comfort from it, but there really isn't anything about that in there.) Yes, there's Song of Solomon (Songs) where the Lover and Beloved celebrate their marriage, and the whole Bible is about how God pursues his people as a Lover pursues his Beloved, but there's no example of humans dealing with unrequited love outside of marriage. The only thing I can think of is Jacob and Rachel, but that's given as an example of immature, lustful "love", eros.

And Hosea and Gomer were an arranged marriage by God, and not love that's really about free will before marriage. I doubt if Hosea truly felt romantic love towards her before he proposed to her because he just had to obey God's command to marry a prostitute. She obviously didn't love him romantically either because she left him for her old ways. Then, God commanded Hosea to woo her back as if he did feel romantic love towards her, which seems so ridiculous to me since he probably didn't feel that way for her anyway.

So, I was wondering if any of you know of something I'm missing. Is there anywhere in the Bible that tackles this issue of unrequited human love? I just feel so sad because I fall so hard for all these guys all the time who just don't want me. This time I think it's not so much about me as about the fact that he knows I don't want to have children. Before he found out about that, I could have sworn I caught him looking at me a few times. But, once he found out I don't want kids, he seemed a bit deflated. I just feel like I can't win. Most Christian guys want to have children and I don't. And it's not like I've got all these guys banging down my door anyway. So, my options are soooooooooooo limited. But this guys is so wonderful! He seems so trustworthy and sweet and he really loves the Lord. I'm so heartbroken.

Tigress

"Name a shrub after me. Preferably one that's prickly and difficult to eradicate."

-Captain Jack Aubrey
"Master and Commander: The Far Side of the World"

Post Edited (Tigress) : 11/2/2005 5:17:35 PM (GMT-6)

markporter
Fire over Oxford

Date Joined Oct 2003
Total Posts : 263

Posted 11/4/2005 3:43 PM (GMT -6)

Grr. I keep thinking of things and then realising you've already written them. I guess maybe romantic love wasn't an issue in quite the same way as it is now back then, though I don't know. I guess you've got all that stuff with Rachel and Leah which you haven't mentioned, but then again it is eventually requited.

Starkman
Registered Member

Date Joined Oct 2001
Total Posts : 1747

Posted 11/5/2005 4:11 PM (GMT -6)

I don't know that you'd have to find something in the Bible directly about romantic love to be comforted. "Peace I leave you. Not as the world leaves you, leave I." That's pretty comforting all the way around.

And yup, I do remember you.

Starkman

My teacher used to say that whenever he read Scripture, he would always ask the question, "What does this have to say about the character of God?" Working off his thinking, as I read Scripture, I have come to ask, "What does this have to say about the heart and passion of God's desire for relationship for us?

Violin for God
Luke, I am your father. --Nooooooooo!!!!!

Date Joined Dec 2004
Total Posts : 690

Posted 11/5/2005 6:09 PM (GMT -6)

Hi Tigress,

You know, there are some Christian guys out there who also don't see children in the picture as well, but granted, yeah, most do want to have kids. I do know of some friends who are married and neither really want kids at this time, and possibly never, but we do know that's rare. There is another married couple who recently had a child, but 10 years ago, the wife didn't want to ever have kids because they used to drive her nuts. But after the 10 years, God kinda molded and shaped her, and later she did desire to have a child.

Do you mind me asking why you don't want kids? (If it's too personal, no worries

) I just realize (especially with being partly unemployed) that society really has us thinking that for us women to have worth we have to bring in a paycheck and pursue our childhood dreams. But perhaps there's a bigger picture that God's aiming for?

I don't think there are any verses in the Bible that specifically address what you're looking for, but perhaps you can think about God Himself being the groom that you're truly looking for? I could go on and on about my story, but suffice it to say that I realized it's not the romantic love I was truly looking for, but the friendship love with a best friend. I didn't realize that for, oh, ... *4* years (about), then suddenly *bonk*, my eyes opened. What do you think?

If you're going to be skeptical, be fair and be skeptical of skepticism.

Post Edited (Violin for God) : 11/5/2005 5:16:47 PM (GMT-6)

Tigress
Registered Member

Date Joined Feb 2003
Total Posts : 1252

Posted 11/6/2005 5:38 PM (GMT -6)

You know what? I had an opportunity to talk with this man on the phone last night - because I was calling everyone in my small group about an upcoming activity - and we talked for an hour and he eventually revealed to me through the course of our conversation - and without any prodding from me - that he doesn't really want to have kids either. Now this obviously doesn't necessarily mean that he's going to ask me out at some point, but at least I now know that there's some hope, which is more than I had before. And yes, I also know I shouldn't get my hopes up so high that I EXPECT him to eventually ask me out, either. So, I'm just relying on the Lord to help me to trust in Him about my future with a husband and to not step ahead of Him in His plans for me.

To answer your question, Violin For God, I have more personal reasons for not wanting kids. It's not about earning a paycheck. I actually hate having to go out and work full-time but of course I'll do it because I have to. I don't want kids because frankly I don't even like being around them, and I don't want to have to give up that much of my life raising them. I mean, you have to give up 18-20 years of your life per child! Granted some of that time overlaps, but still! I want to be able to do other things, and have lots of time with my husband. Frankly, with all that you have to give up, I can't understand why anyone would want to have kids! I think they're precious and all that, and I'd probably enjoy being an aunt, but like I said, I don't want kids to consume a majority of my time. So, there you go.

Anyway, thanks for responding to my post, Everyone. I was afraid nobody really cared.

Tigress

"Name a shrub after me. Preferably one that's prickly and difficult to eradicate."

-Captain Jack Aubrey
"Master and Commander: The Far Side of the World"

Similitude
Registered Member

Date Joined Apr 2004
Total Posts : 4968

Posted 11/6/2005 5:44 PM (GMT -6)

We care, alright, Tigress. Some of us just don't know what the bible makes of the matter, specifically. To the best of my knowledge, unrequited love is just another kind of suffering that humans experience. I've certainly experienced a share of it.

Tigress
Registered Member

Date Joined Feb 2003
Total Posts : 1252

Posted 11/21/2005 6:18 PM (GMT -6)

Well, I opened up my big mouth and told him how I feel and he said that he hadn't even thought about dating me. So, at least now I know. He said we should just pray about it and be friends. (Sigh). Someday my prince will come.

Tigress

"Name a shrub after me. Preferably one that's prickly and difficult to eradicate."

-Captain Jack Aubrey
"Master and Commander: The Far Side of the World"

Violin for God
Luke, I am your father. --Nooooooooo!!!!!

Date Joined Dec 2004
Total Posts : 690

Posted 11/21/2005 6:27 PM (GMT -6)

Dear Tigress, let me just give you a word of encouragement--

IMHO, getting into an EXCELLENT best-friendship first and then dating is WAAAAAAY better than dating first and hoping for a true best-friendship later. I mean, of course attraction's great, but an open friendship from the get-go may perhaps save extra trials in the future.

....Alan and I were friends for about 3 to 3 1/2 years before we started dating. We now both agree that we wouldn't want it to have been any other way.

My new mantra of the month:

VRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM!!!!!!!

(screetch)... VVRRRRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOMMMMMMMMM!!!!!

Sahid
Megistered Rember

Date Joined Jun 2004
Total Posts : 2013

Posted 11/22/2005 5:03 AM (GMT -6)

For what it's worth, I've been through all the ups and downs of romantic love that I'd care to experience, and I've found that friendships, deep and numerous, are what feed my soul. Romance is like the desert; it's nice but it can distract from better things. I'd like to think I've grown up from preferring icecream to preferring steak.

Whatever. Getting turned down bites. Sorry it didn't work out.

Watch me fly. Freedom like wings and I will use them. Freedom like wings and I will spread them wide. - Stavesacre

Truth Aficionado
Registered Member

Date Joined Dec 2003
Total Posts : 1544

Posted 11/22/2005 1:41 PM (GMT -6)

Reciprocal love has to be freely chosen.

Love does not insist on its own way - 1Cor 13

Contradictions if well understood and managed can spark off the fires of invention. Orthodoxy whether of the right or of the left is the graveyard of creativity.

Violin for God
Luke, I am your father. --Nooooooooo!!!!!

Date Joined Dec 2004
Total Posts : 690

Posted 11/26/2005 8:37 PM (GMT -6)

Tigress, one other quick thing to add on to my last post (and Alan doesn't mind me sharing this)...

Alan kept pursuing me for about 3 of those 3 1/2 years. I only saw us as friends... though EVERYBODY else saw that we'd make a good match. After I finally decided to try dating, it was then that I realized that he was the right match... it was only 10 months after that when we got married.

So don't be discouraged when someone wants to be friends. A good friendship increases attraction. A bad one detracts.

You'll find your Prince Charming some day, though it may come as a complete surprise and may not be "love at first sight."

[As Bill and Ted approach Socrates]:

Bill: "Yo Ted, say something profound, dude."

Ted: "Oh, yeah. Right. All we are...is dust in the wind dude."

Bill: ..."Dust".... "Wind" ... "Duuuude".

Socrates: (gasping in awe) "Like sands through the hour glass, so are the days of our lives."

Starkman
Registered Member

Date Joined Oct 2001
Total Posts : 1747

Posted 11/27/2005 5:19 PM (GMT -6)

I met my wife of five years over the Internet. I do NOT advise this, however (she'd agree!). It is simply impossible to know each other...to really know who each other is. Carol and I could not date other than over the phone, because we were several states away. When we did meet, after five months of "dating" over the phone, I flew in to Minneapolis, and we were promply married the next day! We planned it that way. But there was sooooo much stuff we didn't know about each other, and it made things very, very hard for both of us. Oh, we've worked it out, thankfully, and we're on the updward path now, praise the Lord, but both she and I would whole-heartly agree that it is way too dangerous to date via the Net and not have time to date properly.

My two cents...

Starkman

Corey
Five with a Four-wing

Date Joined Feb 2003
Total Posts : 1893

Posted 11/27/2005 7:35 PM (GMT -6)

For myself, marriage kinda boomeranged me. I pursued singleness pretty seriously... I had even proposed to one girl, but we cancelled that so I could go overseas to do mission work. That year changed my life in more ways than one. My heart and my mind were never the same... all I wanted to do was grow old and die in Lithuania. No exaggeration. I was pursuing going back overseas when I met my wife while teaching ESL... and knew that I had found an uncut diamond and would be a fool to not give/give up whatever I could to buy that field. I know I'm stretching that parable a bit from its original intent, but the principle is the same for me.

Likewise, neither of us had any particular interest at the time in having childeren. I recall babysitting overnight for a friend of mine when we had only been married a month. We both resolved after that that we didn't want kids for at least 5 five years. Actually, to be a bit too personal, I was pretty sure my wife couldn't have kids due to some medical stuff when I married her. The punchline: we found out the next day that she was pregnant.

We had three kids (all girls!) in rapid-fire succession, and I CANNOT EXPRESS how utterly profound and meaningful it is. Never saw that coming. But WOW! It changed in my relationship to God, my wife, my self that I could not have imagined.

Tigress
Registered Member

Date Joined Feb 2003
Total Posts : 1252

Posted 12/7/2005 7:50 PM (GMT -6)

Golly gee wonkers, Guys. Thanks for the input.

I've been told by men that unless they're physically attracted to a woman right from the start, they never will be.

Women can develop physical attraction over time with someone they weren't initially attracted to, but apparently men can't - according to what many men say. So Men, is this true or isn't it? Because, frankly I don't hold out much hope that this guy will ever get the hots for me since he hasn't already - and that's soooooooooo frustrating!

Tigress

"Name a shrub after me. Preferably one that's prickly and difficult to eradicate."

-Captain Jack Aubrey
"Master and Commander: The Far Side of the World"

Similitude
Registered Member

Date Joined Apr 2004
Total Posts : 4968

Posted 12/7/2005 8:22 PM (GMT -6)

Tigress: Women can develop physical attraction over time with someone they weren't initially attracted to, but apparently men can't - according to what many men say. So Men, is this true or isn't it? Because, frankly I don't hold out much hope that this guy will ever get the hots for me since he hasn't already - and that's soooooooooo frustrating!

Jeff: I would say that it IS true for some men. Maybe even most. But not all. For some, other characteristics are more important to the point that those characteristics cause the man to SEE the woman as being more attractive than he otherwise would. I suspect that's kinda what you mean about women. And there are some women (probably a minority) for whom physical appearance is paramount.

ThatDarnCat
Registered Member

Date Joined May 2005
Total Posts : 82

Posted 12/7/2005 10:36 PM (GMT -6)

Tigress said...

I've been told by men that unless they're physically attracted to a woman right from the start, they never will be.

Not true.

Haven't you heard of "beer vision"?

The more beer a man consumes, the better looking the women in his vicinity become.

You're welcome.

You might just want to concentrate on being you. Even the purdy gurlz get ugly someday. And when they do, they often haven't developed a personality to sustain them in their ugliness.

Post Edited (ThatDarnCat) : 12/7/2005 11:17:11 PM (GMT-6)

ThatDarnCat
Registered Member

Date Joined May 2005
Total Posts : 82

Posted 12/7/2005 10:59 PM (GMT -6)

Starkman said...
I met my wife of five years over the Internet.

Excellent!

I've seen those websites for Russian Mail Order Brides.

Truth Aficionado
Registered Member

Date Joined Dec 2003
Total Posts : 1544

Posted 12/8/2005 12:10 AM (GMT -6)

ThatDarnCat said...

Starkman said...
I met my wife of five years over the Internet.

Excellent!

I've seen those websites for Russian Mail Order Brides.

Weighing the cost… hmmm… postage stamps or beer? $ $ $ $ $ $

Contradictions if well understood and managed can spark off the fires of invention. Orthodoxy whether of the right or of the left is the graveyard of creativity.

ThatDarnCat
Registered Member

Date Joined May 2005
Total Posts : 82

Posted 12/8/2005 12:18 AM (GMT -6)

Tigress, you may want to try that Canadian custom where if a woman

is interested in a man, she brings a gift 'round to his cabin.

Post Edited (ThatDarnCat) : 12/8/2005 10:12:36 AM (GMT-6)

ThatDarnCat
Registered Member

Date Joined May 2005
Total Posts : 82

Posted 12/8/2005 12:23 AM (GMT -6)

sparknheart said...

ThatDarnCat said...

Starkman said...
I met my wife of five years over the Internet.

I hope he meant she's been his wife for five years.....

Truth Aficionado
Registered Member

Date Joined Dec 2003
Total Posts : 1544

Posted 12/8/2005 12:25 AM (GMT -6)

ThatDarnCat said...

Didn’t the one lass on the ~~left~~ right star in "Fargo"

Contradictions if well understood and managed can spark off the fires of invention. Orthodoxy whether of the right or of the left is the graveyard of creativity.

ThatDarnCat
Registered Member

Date Joined May 2005
Total Posts : 82

Posted 12/8/2005 8:44 AM (GMT -6)

sparknheart said...

ThatDarnCat said...

Didn’t the one lass on the ~~left~~ right star in "Fargo"

I may be mistaken. This just may be a Canadian tailgate party.

Truth Aficionado
Registered Member

Date Joined Dec 2003
Total Posts : 1544

Posted 12/8/2005 2:29 PM (GMT -6)

My husband use to just sit home all day long in front of the TV smoking and drinking, beer after beer after..... I could never get him out of the house to go shopping with me! shakehead

That’s until I switched his beer to Moosehead!

Now he loves to ride along everywhere I go. And he hasn’t smoked in weeks. Yes ladies, Moosehead beer worked for my marriage and it can work for yours too.

Warring: Do not let husband exceed recommended consumption when trying to get pregnant.

ThatDarnCat
Registered Member

Date Joined May 2005
Total Posts : 82

Posted 12/8/2005 5:05 PM (GMT -6)

A Møøse once bit my sister ...

Tastic
Registered Member

Date Joined May 2004
Total Posts : 6

Posted 7/26/2006 5:29 AM (GMT -6)

Tigress I remember you too...I was only on for a few weeks but managed to fall for you. Then I changed computers and have come back to find you...and here you are!

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