 |
| Open Theism Discussion Board > Public Forums > General Chat > Two things about Communion (from Farley's Romans commentary) | Forum Quick Jump
|
| 
Sahid
Megistered Rember
Date Joined Jun 2004
Total Posts : 2013
| Posted 6/4/2008 2:53 PM (GMT -6) |   | I guess by 'metaphorical' I mean what others mean by 'mystical'. It's hard to say for sure since 'mystical' can mean anything or nothing at the same time. I say metaphorical, because it's a word that I think makes sense.
Just as Christ is NOT a vine in all respects and IS a vine in a metaphorical respect, followers of Christ are NOT the body of Christ in every respect but ARE the body of Christ in a metaphorical respect. Metaphorical titles litter the entire Bible, Old Testament and New. I believe these are usually meant to be taken figuratively.
Either in this thread or the other I mentioned the Spirit descending on Jesus "as a dove" or "in the bodily form of a dove". What is the significance of this being a vision? It means that Jesus was filled with the Spirit and commissioned and endorsed by the Father. Now, what is the further significance of this being more than a vision? What significance is added if we believe the Spirit was incarnated in the living, breathing, pooping body of a dove? None, I contend. Still, Jesus is Spirit-filled, commissioned, and endorsed just as before.
Similarly, we can speak of the Church as the body of Christ. It is clear to all (I think) that this is clearly untrue in certain respects. You can just look at two followers and see that they are clearly two separate bodies, neither of which is Christ. What seems to be at issue is some sort of metaphysical union of the two or more in the body of Christ. I believe in such a union (and I even hesitantly say that we all do). If we just leave it there everyone is happy. But when I go further to define more precisely what I mean, there are problems. I think we are the body of Christ in the same way that Christ is a vine, the Spirit is a dove, and the Father is a consuming fire: metaphorically. I say this is a true metaphor so long as it is what it is and is not stretched or twisted into something else. The non-memorialist use of the word 'real' seems to often mean "objectively real". That is where I draw the line.
People build images a worship them, often with good intentions. The temple was built for the worship of God, but it became an object of worship. Jesus redirected worship. Neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem, but in spirit and in truth. I fear that some do the same with the elements. The difference is that some actually acknowledge this and built it a justifying theology. "Worship of the elements is not idolatry, because the elements ARE God." If the elements are God in only a metaphorical sense, then it's still idolatry, so what is required to justify this worship is the objectively real equivalence of God and the elements. We would never think to draw such an equivalence from Jesus' claims to be a shepherd, vine, gate, or groom. The only difference between these claims and the claims of identity with the elements is that the latter are necessary to justify a ritual. And once Christ's body achieved this special status, it's other use as a metaphor for the Church also became objectified.
Now I'm not denying that the bread might objectively be Christ's body or that we as Church might objectively be the body. But such claims are so nonsensical (or mystical), extra-biblical, and practically insignificant, that I can't understand why they should be entertained, much less made grounds for disfellowship.
Watch me fly. Freedom like wings and I will use them. Freedom like wings and I will spread them wide. - Stavesacre | | Back to Top | | |
 |
PotOnWheel
Registered Member
Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 9890
| Posted 6/4/2008 4:21 PM (GMT -6) | | | | |
| 27 posts in this thread.
Viewing Page : 1 2 |
| Forum Information | Currently it is Monday, November 09, 2026 4:05 PM (GMT -6)
There are a total of 97,718 posts in 6,040 threads.
In the last 3 days there were 0 new threads and 0 reply posts. View Active Threads
|
Forum powered by dotNetBB v2.42EC SP3
dotNetBB © 2000-2026 |
|
|