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PotOnWheel
Registered Member
Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 9890
| Posted 6/8/2004 8:36 AM (GMT -6) |   | quote:
Originally posted by 1way
I sincerely hope I am wrong about your habit of honoring what seems right in man's eyes instead of God's eyes, and I apologize if I have misjudged you.
Apology acepted. | | Back to Top | | |
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1way
Registered Member
Date Joined Oct 2001
Total Posts : 299
| Posted 6/8/2004 10:07 AM (GMT -6) | | POW - There is no forgiveness if there is no repentance. I did not repent from anything, I am glad to give you a hard time for placing so much more time and energy and emphasis on man's thinking in matters of faith in God. The little I know about you, you do focus too much attention to what man says instead of what God says.
If I ask a bible or spiritual question, your most common response is to give me mostly manmade tradition, and perhaps a little bible tagged on for good measure. And when I ask your belief in a particular bible issue, like 1Cor 13 the love chapter and if "believing all things" means "believing all things without exception", you defer a direct answer, but you could write books on traditions and other such things.
If you don't like it that I expect believers to primarily trust in God's word above man's word, then just get it off your chest and say so, if not, then agree with me and stop this charade. Do you or don't you agree with what I just stated, yes or no?
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PotOnWheel
Registered Member
Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 9890
| Posted 6/9/2004 2:15 PM (GMT -6) | | | Tom, I had a wonderful little exchange with you. | | Back to Top | | |
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1way
Registered Member
Date Joined Oct 2001
Total Posts : 299
| Posted 6/10/2004 2:11 PM (GMT -6) | | | | |
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1way
Registered Member
Date Joined Oct 2001
Total Posts : 299
| Posted 6/10/2004 2:17 PM (GMT -6) | | larris - I heard and from the first accepted and understood your reluctance to accept the open view.
Then I responded assuming your view accurately with an attempt to persuade you for the open view, offering you some specific bible reasoning for support.
Then you basically restated that you do not agree with the open view.
I am specifically interested in your response to my bible arguments. I can't tell by your response if you read my post or just scanned it. Please give it a careful read, I made it specifically for you.
You said quote:
I don't think it's as much a matter of God changing his mind as that he perfoms his word. If God says it, God's gong to do it and he always gives people the choice of life or death, blessing or cursing. Then as they choose one or the other, he hastens to perform what he has already said he would do.
That is what most Christians say. But, I don't believe any of you are consistent with that. Lets plug in your idea into Jer 18 "the Potter and the Clay" and see if how consistent you really are.  God's word says: quote:
Jer 18:7 "The instant I speak concerning a nation and concerning a kingdom, to pluck up, to pull down, and to destroy [it], 8 "if that nation against whom I have spoken turns from its evil, I will relent of the disaster that I thought to bring upon it.
9 "And the instant I speak concerning a nation and concerning a kingdom, to build and to plant it,
10 "if it does evil in My sight so that it does not obey My voice, then I will relent concerning the good with which I said I would benefit it.
So, through the prophet Jeremiah, the prophetic word was given to him in verses 1-10, but you would not allow God to fulfill that word, because you suggest that God must do what He said or thought He would do. So tell me, why are you being inconsistent here? How do you decide which prophetic words of God are to be considered faithful must be fulfilled and which are not?
How about the following example of a prophecy that God says He did not bring to pass? Do you deny that prophet word as actually coming to pass too? (v.10b that God said He did not do what He said He would do) Consider. quote:
The prophesy first given
Jon 3:4 And Jonah began to enter the city on the first day’s walk. Then he cried out and said, "Yet forty days, and Nineveh shall be overthrown!" The prophesy was considered to be a lethal judgment against their nation. 3:9 Who can tell [if] God will turn and relent, and turn away from His fierce anger, so that we may not perish? They repented, and then God repented from bringing to pass His prophesy of national disaster, and He did not do it. 10 Then God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way; and God relented from the disaster that He had said He would bring upon them, and He did not do it. and God's word shows a correlation of God's actions in the following way. 4:2 So he prayed to the LORD, and said, "Ah, LORD, was not this what I said when I was still in my country? Therefore I fled previously to Tarshish; for I know that You [are] a gracious and merciful God, slow to anger and abundant in lovingkindness, One who relents from doing harm.
So in verse 10, do you accept God's prophetic word there(?) that God reference His spoken prophesy of national destruction in that He repented from bringing that prophesy to pass, and He did not do it. By your response, you seem to be rejecting the teachings that state that God repents and does not always do what He said or thought He was going to do (= divine repentance). | | Back to Top | | |
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PotOnWheel
Registered Member
Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 9890
| Posted 6/22/2004 3:07 PM (GMT -6) | | "PotOnWheel" is the handle I chose when I began posting on this board.
I'm a potter. Second generation. When I was young I could "throw" pots 24-inches high in one section. (Haven't tried that fete for a while.)
I HAVE given presentations that involved a reading from Jeremiah's visit to the "Potter's House." I like doing it.
Something that not many people think about is this: That Jeremiah while saw a lot of things, and reported on them . . . he didn't see everything. And that--I believe--is important! Jeremiah did NOT SEE the potter's LEFT HAND. The Right hand is strict. It defines, determines. But the left hand, the more intuitive hand, "guides" without determining. there is a synergistic relationship between the Potter and the Clay. (I've always found Calvinists quick to AGREE with this, and I've given it in Calvinist sanctuaries!) Jeremiah did not see that hand. He didn't see the hand that can be thought to represent the Spirit's leading!
God works: this is seen in the whole thing, from the kneeding and twisting of the clay, centering, raising. We can be seen: the properties, "willingness" and readiness of the clay, its "personality" and the history it builds up in its structural and material memory. (Failed pots can be made into less risky pots...as their clay is "tired." And the Spirit "can't" be seen: and THAT is important!!!
Thanks for asking.
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PotOnWheel
Registered Member
Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 9890
| Posted 6/22/2004 3:13 PM (GMT -6) | | Consider this, too.
That the incarnation holds a secret. A "mystery." Many did not know that they were beholding (and holding) the Son of God. But he was the hidden mystery of God's merciful Grace.
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