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rsirkel
Registered Member
Date Joined May 2002
Total Posts : 183
| Posted 12/5/2004 4:24 PM (GMT -6) |   | borg
The gospel is the proclamation that Jesus is Lord. In Paul's day there was a growing Caesar cult proclaiming Caesar as Lord. Proclaiming Jesus as Lord was not some take it or leave it 12 step plan for man to initiate in his life in order to be saved but a call to submission to this reality.
This gospel is also the power of God unto salvation. So I would also say it was proclaiming Jesus as Lord and what faithfully fullfilled promises God had accomplished for the salvation of man which reveals God's righteousness (his faithfulness to covenant). The faithful life of obedience to the Father's will, by Jesus, unto his death on the cross and the faithful saving actions of the Father in raising Jesus from the dead inaugurated the new creation and gave hope to those who trust in him. All the grace of God. Man's response to the gospel is allegiance (faithfulness) to God who vindicates (justifies his loyal covenant partners).
Peace
Ron | | Back to Top | | |
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1Heart
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Date Joined Feb 2004
Total Posts : 1128
| Posted 12/5/2004 8:17 PM (GMT -6) | | quote:
Originally posted by borg
I've been reading some material on "evangelicalism", the history, meaning, etc.; and I'm curious what some of you have to say the "gospel" is. When we preach the gospel, when Paul (or any other apostle) speaks of the gospel; what are they talking about? Anyone interested in sharing their opinion?
Borg
When I was a new believer, the gospel (good news) meant simply Christ dying, and being resurrected for me. Paul stated that he was glad that he preached just that. Billy Graham preaches a clear, simple gospel message, and tens of thousands respond.
Now the gospel means more to me. It obviously means my salvation, and eternal destiny, but it also means that I am being sanctified, transformed from one degree of glory into another - into the image of the Son. It also means that creation will be restored, that the cross was an act of war. It means that my choices affect eternity, not just those in my immediate circle. It means that I am an heir to all that Jesus has to offer. It means that I have an intimate personal relationship with the lover of my soul...
His grace and mercy abound to me. His love is incomprehensible, unfathomable, and as solid as a mountain.
It's all...good news!
God Bless,
Jo-Anne 
"Sometimes all we can do is go back to the character of God, and drop anchor there."
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pdaviesoz
Registered Member
Date Joined Nov 2004
Total Posts : 63
| Posted 12/5/2004 10:46 PM (GMT -6) | | If you read the Gospels, the gospel that Jesus preached wa very different. He proclaimed the manifest presence of the Kingdom, as evidenced by the works He did. Interesting that he said "THIS gospel" will be preached in all the world before the end comes.
Much of our Evangelical heritage has focused exclusively on the Cross. This is a fundamental part of the gospel, but is NOT the whole picture. We need to learn how to live in Kingdom reality, where the "deaf hear, lame walk,blind receive their sight".
Paul D | | Back to Top | | |
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rsirkel
Registered Member
Date Joined May 2002
Total Posts : 183
| Posted 12/6/2004 7:37 AM (GMT -6) | | lock
[quote] Paul states in Galatians 2:7 and 8 that the "gospel" of the Uncircumcision was entrusted to him and that the "gospel" of the Cirsumcision was entrusted to Peter. Does this mean that the "gospels" are different?/quote]
Ron
Romans 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.
17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.
Paul mentions in verse 16 to the Jew first and also to the Greek.
I think he is referring to the circumcision and uncircumcision. When there are accounts in Acts recorded of preaching to the Jews, the hope of the coming Messiah as God had promised is proclaimed. That is, the expectation of the fulfillment of God's promises to Israel was proclaimed as being fulfilled. That is why he says "therein is the righteousness of God revealed (Faithfulness of God to His covenant promises) from faith to faith.(My paraphrase of this would be from His faithful act revealed to another of His faithful acts revealed. This has been debated all through church history so I'm open to other options). It is the same gospel that Jesus is Israel's Messiah and the worlds Lord proven by God's seal of resurrection from the dead. Maybe Peter's mandate was generally limited to Jews, though he preached to the first gentiles at Cornelious' house and Paul's to the gentiles, though he seemed to preach to the Jew first and then to the gentile in the cities he went to. In any case Jesus Messiah is preached.
Peace
Ron
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lock
Registered Member
Date Joined Jul 2004
Total Posts : 701
| Posted 12/6/2004 8:09 AM (GMT -6) | | Ron-
Paul makes it clear the role of the gentile in the "kingdom" gospel was to bring the Israelites to jealousy (Rom. 10,11). Salvation was to be preached to the nations (or gentiles) through Israel (the kingdom of priests). I believe that when God set Israel aside (Acts 28:28) that the "kingdom" was also set aside with them. The "gospel" was then taken directly to the gentiles. As Eph. 2 tells us...
13 But now you belong to Christ Jesus. Though you once were far away from God, now you have been brought near to him because of the blood of Christ.
14 For Christ himself has made peace between us Jews and you Gentiles by making us all one people. He has broken down the wall of hostility that used to separate us. 15 By his death he ended the whole system of Jewish law that excluded the Gentiles. His purpose was to make peace between Jews and Gentiles by creating in himself one new person from the two groups. 16 Together as one body, Christ reconciled both groups to God by means of his death, and our hostility toward each other was put to death. 17 He has brought this Good News of peace to you Gentiles who were far away from him, and to us Jews who were near. 18 Now all of us, both Jews and Gentiles, may come to the Father through the same Holy Spirit because of what Christ has done for us.
In the "body" of Christ there is neither jew nor gentile, male nor female, slave nor free, etc. It is not to the Jew first, then the gentile, but now it can come directly to anyone. But Israel will be restored and agian salvation will be brought the the nations through the kingdom of priests when Jesus returns to set up His millennial kingdom.
Their is also 2 parts to the Messiah (Messiah ben joseph and Messiah ben david). The one is the suffering servant (as illustrated in the life of Joseph), the other, the conquering king (as illustrated in the life of king David). Jesus fulfilled the suffering servant part during His first appearance on earth and will fulfill the conquering king part when He returns. Part of the problem was that Israel expected the conquering king Messiah only. Even though the old testament scriptures testified to the sufferings of the Messiah, it was hidden from the people of Israel. When Jesus entered Jerusalem on Palm Sunday, the people of Israel expected Him to save them from the Roman occupation, not their sins. Jesus even has to explain it and open the understanding of His own disciples after His resurrection so that they would understand His sufferings (Luke 24:25-27). So I would agree that that ben joseph role of the Messiah has been fulfilled, but the ben david role will be fulfilled in future when Jesus returns.
His achievement are we, being created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God makes ready beforehand, that we should be walking in them. | | Back to Top | | |
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rsirkel
Registered Member
Date Joined May 2002
Total Posts : 183
| Posted 12/6/2004 8:59 AM (GMT -6) | | lock
I was referring to just your question, "if there were different gospels?" and replied with a snippet of info. I agree with most of what you said in your presentation of the overall plan. What Paul practiced,preaching to the Jew first, I don't take as a rule, it was just his passion for his brethren according to the flesh to be saved. I am not sure of what you mean by setting aside the kingdom. I do believe Romans 9,10, and 11 tells us God will still be faithful to his promise to Israel and for the gentiles not to boast because they were grafted in and the Jews cut off. God will still take iniquity from Jacob.
Peace
Ron
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pdaviesoz
Registered Member
Date Joined Nov 2004
Total Posts : 63
| Posted 12/6/2004 10:49 AM (GMT -6) | | The "key" understanding that is different in Biblical times to today is POWER. Jesus demonstrated the manifest presence of the Kingdom and operation of Kingdom reality everywhere he went.
It's not so much what message is preached (or which part of the "good news"), but its relevance to the hearers and the opportunity for God to demonstrate His glory and meet people one-on-one. Whether we focus on the Cross as our message (of the moment) or on the healing power of Jesus, or deliverance from the power of the enemy, or God really loves you, its the POWER, not the words themselves, that is the missing ingredient in todays church.
The world wants to see evidence of God's love for them. Jesus always gave that. Most of us Evangelicals give words, because we haven't been taught about power and have no experience with it. many of us have been taight to distrust it.
1 Cor 4:20 "the kingdom of God is not a matter of talk but of power."
Paul D | | Back to Top | | |
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rsirkel
Registered Member
Date Joined May 2002
Total Posts : 183
| Posted 12/6/2004 4:32 PM (GMT -6) | | Paul D
quote:
The world wants to see evidence of God's love for them. Jesus always gave that. Most of us Evangelicals give words, because we haven't been taught about power and have no experience with it. many of us have been taight to distrust it.
Ron
The best evidence of God's love for them is preaching the death and resurrection story of Jesus Messiah with the Holy Ghost sent down from heaven. Jesus is the power of God and the wisdom of God. I understand where you are coming from Paul, I invested 30 years in the word of faith teaching. It was the Holy Spirit who turned my heart from my faith to His faithfulness and then taught me the good news of God's faithfulness to fulfill His covenant promises. We can discuss which are the proper translations, faith in Jesus (objective genitive, anthropological centered faith) or the faith of Jesus (subjective genitive, christological centered faith)if you like on another thread?
Peace
Ron | | Back to Top | | |
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pdaviesoz
Registered Member
Date Joined Nov 2004
Total Posts : 63
| Posted 12/7/2004 10:33 AM (GMT -6) | | I've just been listening to a tape (well Message {MP3}) and the Lord spoke something from the message onto my heart.
The Gospel can be summed up: "On Earth, as it is in heaven!"
Jesus modelled this, few have walked in it.
The Cross is the door into this reality. Too long we have focused exclusively on the DOOR, not the REALITY. The DOOR is important, but God wants us walking in the actuality of hte blessing that Jesus made available to us via the Cross.
The World will sit up and take notice when they see: "On Earth, as it is in Heaven." Then, God will receive the Glory dure his Name from those who repent.
Paul D | | Back to Top | | |
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barryatk
Registered Member
Date Joined Jun 2004
Total Posts : 101
| Posted 12/7/2004 12:12 PM (GMT -6) | | This is an interesting thread. I think we will never exhaust the expressions of the gospel. We all know it means "good news". The best of all good news is that where we once were lost we now are found! I love Paul D's words...on earth as in heaven. I think the gospel is what is at work when any truly good thing, say godly thing, is happening to me or through me. Becoming saved is the great and needed beginning and there is a ton more to follow. I think Jesus words in Luke 4 where He says He has come to set the captives free, give sight to the blind, and declare the favorable year of God...is one great overview of the gospel. And though I've never been physically blind or paralyzed...I have been there spiritually, emotionally and mentally and in some small way can identify with the maladies of most men and identify also with the healing they all can find and many do, thank God!
So is it not the gospel when I see my young sons becoming Christlike! When my daughters begin to love the things of God and moving in His Spirit!? Is it not the gospel when any freedom-bringing revelation from God begins to make its way into my heart and mind? Is not anything at all that God is involved in on earth...The Gospel!
I like Moon-river's expereince that the gospel is her transformation, her sanctification, her being heir to the Kingdom...all these I agree with!
And the Word of Faith stream surely at its core and at its best too is bringing gospel truth to the body of Christ!
Barry | | Back to Top | | |
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