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Tom
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Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 10353
 
   Posted 4/24/2005 2:07 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.

Hey John (JEE)!

 

How you like this summary of Moral Gov’t Theology by the Christian Research Center: http://www.iclnet.org/pub/resources/text/cri/cri-jrnl/crj0184a.txt ?

Check it out:

 

[Moral government theology (MGT), rooted in the philosophical definition of freedom as the "power of contrary choice," denies the fundamental Christian 
doctrines of God's perfection in knowledge, goodness, and power; original sin; human moral inability; the substitutionary satisfaction of God's justice in 
Christ's atoning death; redemption; and justification by the crediting of Christ's righteousness to believers by grace through faith apart from works. As 
documented in this article, these denials are unbiblical and are so serious as to warrant classifying MGT as non-Christian.]
 
Tom
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JEE
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Date Joined Jul 2004
Total Posts : 1466
 
   Posted 4/24/2005 7:33 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
...denies the fundamental doctrines of God's perfection in knowledge, 
Not any more true of MGT than of Open Theism. 
goodness, 
What is goodness, if not voluntary? I can hardly see how this is a valid criticism. MGT affirms God is perfectly good, just that He is not good INVOLUNTARILY.  
and power; 
Huh? I'm not seeing that, really. 
original sin; 
Guilty as charged; If Calvinism is the measure of orthodoxy, then all us Open Theists are heretics.  
human moral inability; 
Guilty as charged; If Calvinism is the measure of orthodoxy, then all us Open Theists are heretics.   
the substitutionary satisfaction of God's justice in 
Christ's atoning death; redemption; and justification by the crediting of Christ's righteousness to believers by grace through faith apart from works. 
The penal substitution view is definitely NOT the only way sincere Christians have viewed Christ's death. 
As documented in this article, these denials are unbiblical and are so serious as to warrant classifying MGT as non-Christian.
So what else is new? Calvinists often say everyone who disagrees with them is "non-Christian." 
 


May the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit.


JohnE


http://revivaltheology.net

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selah
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Date Joined Oct 2001
Total Posts : 1210
 
   Posted 4/25/2005 5:25 AM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Hey John,

Will you please explain MGT (its origin and basic suppositions) and why you hold it?


Thanks.

love
selah

P.S. I did read the link TGB posted, still, it's hard to believe you'd agree
with the following:
As Olson puts it, "_the will determines the nature or
character, rather than the nature the will_" (emphasis added).[22]
Should God ever choose to make His character other than wise and
holy and perfect -- and no "internal force of nature" can prevent
His doing so -- then of course that wise and holy and perfect
character will no longer limit what He wills; a different sort of
character will do so. To put it simply, we have no _assurance_ that
God will not decide tomorrow to become the Devil.


well, what do I know? :-)


1 Corinthians 2:1-5
When I came to you, brothers, I did not come with eloquence or superior wisdom as I proclaimed to you the testimony about God. 2 For I resolved to know nothing while I was with you except Jesus Christ and him crucified. 3 I came to you in weakness and fear, and with much trembling. 4 My message and my preaching were not with wise and persuasive words, but with a demonstration of the Spirit’s power, 5 so that your faith might not rest on men’s wisdom, but on God’s power.

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JEE
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Date Joined Jul 2004
Total Posts : 1466
 
   Posted 4/25/2005 10:19 AM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Selah said...
Hey John,

Will you please explain MGT (its origin and basic suppositions) and why you hold it?


Thanks.

love
selah

P.S. I did read the link TGB posted, still, it's hard to believe you'd agree
with the following:
As Olson puts it, "_the will determines the nature or
character, rather than the nature the will_" (emphasis added).[22]
Should God ever choose to make His character other than wise and
holy and perfect -- and no "internal force of nature" can prevent
His doing so -- then of course that wise and holy and perfect
character will no longer limit what He wills; a different sort of
character will do so. To put it simply, we have no _assurance_ that
God will not decide tomorrow to become the Devil.


well, what do I know? :-)

Hi Selah,
 
The part you have bolded are not Olson's words, but are the opinion of the (very negative) commentor.
 
MGT (Moral Government Theology) derives from the New England Theology (or New School Divinity) that arose in response to Calvinism and Universalism in early American history. The most famous propagator of MGT was noted revivalist Charles Grandison Finney. Though Finney did not teach what is now known of as Open Theism, many MGT advocates in the past century have also embraced what is now known as the Open View, dating back to the 1940s and 50s, long before the term "Open Theism" even became known.
 
As I have tried to state as plainly as I could in another thread RE: God's character, we can have total confidence, based on what we know of God's faithfulness, that He will NEVER decide to become the Devil.  (Where's the rolleyes icon when you need it, anyway? )
 
Blessings,
 
John (your friendly neighborhood heretic).


May the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit.


JohnE


http://www.revivaltheology.cjb.net

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JEE
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Date Joined Jul 2004
Total Posts : 1466
 
   Posted 4/25/2005 10:24 AM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Basically, the only criticisms I have seen of MGT (and of the Open View, for that matter) are that they do not agree with Calvinism.


May the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit.


JohnE


http://www.revivaltheology.cjb.net

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JEE
Registered Member


Date Joined Jul 2004
Total Posts : 1466
 
   Posted 4/25/2005 12:51 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Oh yeah. Meant to say...

The most basic premise of Moral Gov't Theology is the distinction between God's governance of the material universe by cause and effect and His governance of the MORAL universe by motives/moral suasion.

John


May the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit.


JohnE


http://www.revivaltheology.cjb.net

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