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Corey
Five with a Four-wing

Date Joined Feb 2003
Total Posts : 1893

Posted 2/15/2007 8:49 AM (GMT -6)

Something occurred to me yesterday while reading in Matthew 26. ALL the disciples expected a political takeover, and all forsake Jesus when they saw that it wasn't going to pan out as expected. In this sense, Judas was actually more insightful than the others -- he realized earlier than the others that Jesus was going down. In his disillusionment he realized that he needed to, in market terms, sell -- and sell fast -- while there's still some value left in the stock. Insider trading. 30 pieces of silver, along with being aligned with the winning team, isn't a bad salvage operation. Maybe it's not coincidence that Judas handled the finances for the group.

It's easy in hindsight to "pile on" him as the traitor, but I think we see in Jesus' arrest that the others also went down a very similar path. Perhaps the only difference was timing; the stock had already tanked.

⁵⁵At that time Jesus said to the crowd, "Am I leading a rebellion, that you have come out with swords and clubs to capture me? Every day I sat in the temple courts teaching, and you did not arrest me. ⁵⁶But this has all taken place that the writings of the prophets might be fulfilled." Then all the disciples deserted him and fled.

Panic in the market. SELL, SELL! Judas found a buyer, but the others didn't. Given slightly different circumstances, it seems each of them could have just as easily been the betrayer.

Post Edited (Corey) : 2/15/2007 7:54:53 AM (GMT-6)

Starkman
Registered Member

Date Joined Oct 2001
Total Posts : 1747

Posted 2/15/2007 9:25 AM (GMT -6)

I think that's good insight, Corey. I read somewhere, but I can't remember, about the idea of Judas having a political agenda and all, but it isn't as implied in Scripture (that I can recall) as I wish it were, though I tend to agree with you, as your view is the view I have held.

Starkman

My teacher used to say that whenever he read Scripture, he would always ask the question, "What does this have to say about the character of God?" Working off his thinking, as I read Scripture, I have come to ask, "What does this have to say about the heart and passion of God's desire for relationship with us?

Sahid
Megistered Rember

Date Joined Jun 2004
Total Posts : 2013

Posted 2/15/2007 2:16 PM (GMT -6)

If Judas saw Jesus as a savior in the same way that Mary did in the magnificat, then he may have thought he was organizing the first shot in Jesus' revolutionary war. This would explain why he regretted his betrayal only after Jesus was condemned to die. It seems like Judas expected to hand over Jesus to people who wanted to kill him without actually getting Jesus killed. I think he expected Jesus to somehow be vindicated, either by the people who would rise to his aid or God who would intervene in a spectacular way (or maybe both). But Jesus was not to be vindicated until he had completed his work. The work of Jesus that God vindicated was his willingness to suffer unjustly - to love sinners - without immediate vindication.

Watch me fly. Freedom like wings and I will use them. Freedom like wings and I will spread them wide. - Stavesacre

Corey
Five with a Four-wing

Date Joined Feb 2003
Total Posts : 1893

Posted 2/26/2007 8:59 AM (GMT -6)

Okay, another thought on Judas after reading the next section in Matthew 26. What exactly were they paying him for? For betrayal, right? But where was Judas when they were looking for a witness against Jesus? Why didn't he testify? Having second thoughts?

⁵⁹The chief priests and the whole Sanhedrin were looking for false evidence against Jesus so that they could put him to death. ⁶⁰But they did not find any, though many false witnesses came forward.

I've never noticed this before and am quite surprised that Judas didn't "drive it home".

Post Edited (Corey) : 2/26/2007 8:03:19 AM (GMT-6)

Sahid
Megistered Rember

Date Joined Jun 2004
Total Posts : 2013

Posted 2/26/2007 7:14 PM (GMT -6)

Again, I think it is because Judas wanted the authorities to confront Jesus but not defeat him.

Watch me fly. Freedom like wings and I will use them. Freedom like wings and I will spread them wide. - Stavesacre

Corey
Five with a Four-wing

Date Joined Feb 2003
Total Posts : 1893

Posted 2/28/2007 5:31 PM (GMT -6)

I agree. Today we went through the first chunk of Matthew 27, where Judas hanged himself, springing from his remorse that Jesus was condemned. I don't think he ever expected Jesus to be condemned; he probably only intended to prod his confrontation with the authorities, fully expecting him to kick butt. So I retract my earlier statements that he was simply cashing in his stock. We see here he didn't really care about cashing in.

Starkman
Registered Member

Date Joined Oct 2001
Total Posts : 1747

Posted 3/5/2007 5:14 PM (GMT -6)

I don't know. Jesus' statement to him during the Passover doesn't seem to ring true to anything but, "Someone here is going to betray me." This doesn't sound like, "Someone here's going to press the issue and see that I confront the authorities, fully execting me to kick butt." I believe it means what it means: Judas was going to betray Christ. Perhaps, though, he didn't have the guts to testify, knowing first hand how hard that would be. After all, Judas did see Jesus in action with everybody and everyone when it came to confrontation and debate. Too, he probably knew something of the penetrating look into the heart Jesus had and didn't want to take chances of having to deal with that.

Starkman

Corey
Five with a Four-wing

Date Joined Feb 2003
Total Posts : 1893

Posted 3/6/2007 8:21 AM (GMT -6)

Good points, and I agree that Jesus had in mind that Judas would betray him. I'm just not sure that Judas had this in mind; I think he had a rationalization in place that facilitated his betrayal. You may be right that Judas didn't testify because he didn't have the guts to go face-to-face with Jesus, but none-the-less we must agree that Judas came to profoundly regret his action, despair to the point of suicide. So I guess I still don't think that he didn't testify because of cowardice, but because he didn't want to be part of the way things were going down; at no point (as far as I can tell) did he want Jesus condemned to death. He was after something else.

Sahid
Megistered Rember

Date Joined Jun 2004
Total Posts : 2013

Posted 3/6/2007 8:35 AM (GMT -6)

The betrayal was meant to be superficial. It was to look like a betrayal. He thought he was sending the messiah to the palace and laying the groundwork for some Old Testament style coup. But in fact the betrayal was more than superficial. The kingdom that Jesus preached specifically calls for subordination to evil people and structures. Well before Judas kissed him, Jesus had told his followers that discipleship meant laying down one's life and taking the role of a man condemned by evil occupiers to die. Just a few days earlier he had told them not to seek high rank like the Gentile rulers, but to become servants and slaves instead.

Judas either ignored or spiritualized these teachings. That was his true betrayal.

Watch me fly. Freedom like wings and I will use them. Freedom like wings and I will spread them wide. - Stavesacre

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