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Sahid
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Date Joined Jun 2004
Total Posts : 2013
 
   Posted 8/3/2004 8:18 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
  • Have the main service on Sunday in the morning. Everyone loves to sleep in on Sunday morning.
  • Dress up when you go to church. It makes things more intimidating, and makes people without nice clothes feel like church is not for them.
  • Use hymns/liturgies/versions of the Bible that are hundreds of years old. That way things will be harder to understand and most connections to real life will be lost. Phrases like "Lamb of God" and "marching to Zion" bring the most wonderful blank stares from the unchurched.


Watch me fly. Freedom like wings and I will use them. Freedom like wings and I will spread them wide. - Stavesacre

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PotOnWheel
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Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 9890
 
   Posted 8/4/2004 3:59 AM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Joy


quote:
Christianity often appears, however, to preach that if men will try hard enough to live Christian lives, the crucifixion can somehow be reversed. This is because Christianity has forgotten itself, forgotten that always it must first of all stand at the cross. Not that this world cannot be improved-one of our goals is certainly to work for peace, justice, freedom. But while it can be improved, it can never become the place God intended it to be. Christianity does not condemn the world. The world has condemned itself when on Calvary it condemned the One who was its true self. "He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not" (Jn. 1:10). If we think seriously about the real meaning, the real scope of these words, we know that as Christians and insofar as we are Christians. We are, first of all, witnesses of that end: end of all natural joy; end of all satisfaction of man with the world ahd with himself; end, indeed, of life itself as a reasonable and reasonably organized "pursuit of happiness." Christians did not have to wait for the modern proponents of existentialist anxiety, despair and absurdity to be aware of all this. And although in the course of their long history Christians have much too often forgotten the meaning of the cross, and enjoyed life as if "nothing had happened," although each one of us too often takes "time off-we know that in the world in which Christ died, "natural life" has been brought to its end.

2
And yet, from its very beginning Christianity has been the proclamation of joy, of the only possible joy on earth. It rendered impossible all joy we usually think of as possible. But within this impossibility, at the very bottom of this darkness, it announced and conveyed a new all-embracing joy, and with this joy it transformed the End into a Beginning. Without the proclamation of this joy Christianity is incomprehensible. It is only as joy that the Church was victorious in the world, and it lost the world when it lost that joy, and ceased to be a credible witness to it. Of all accusations against Christians, the most terrible one was uttered by Nietzsche when he said that Christians had no joy.

Let us, therefore, forget for a while the technical discussions about the Church, its mission, its methods. Not that these discussions are wrong or unnecessary-but they can be useful and meaningful only within a fundamental context, and that context is the "great joy" from which everything else in Christianity developed and acquired its meaning. "For, behold, I bring you good tidings of great joy"-thus begins the Gospel, and its end is: "And they worshipped him and returned to Jerusalem with great joy." (Lk. 2:10, 24:52). And we must recover the meaning of this great joy. We must if possible partake of it, before we discuss anything else- programs and missions, projects and techniques.



Alexander Schmemann, "For the Life of the World"

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PotOnWheel
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Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 9890
 
   Posted 8/4/2004 4:23 AM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.

"Make no little plans. They have
no magic to stir men's blood and
probably themselves will not
be realized. Make big plans;
aim high in hope and work,
remembering that a noble, logical
diagram once recorded will never die,
but long after we are gone will
be a living thing, asserting itself
with ever-growing insistency.
Remember that our sons and grandsons
are going to do things that
would stagger us. Let your watchword
be order and your beacon beauty.
Think big."



Daniel Burnham: "father of the skyscraper"; chief coordinating architect for the World Columbian Exposition, of 1893; co-author of the Chicago Plan, which laid out plans for the future of Chicago in 1909. It was the first comprehensive plan for the controlled growth of an American city, an outgrowth of the "City Beautiful" movement. The plan included ambitious proposals for the lakefront and river and declared that every citizen should be within walking distance of a park.


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Sisters of Cain
Registered Member


Date Joined Mar 2004
Total Posts : 431
 
   Posted 8/10/2004 5:07 AM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
quote:
Originally posted by Sahid

  • Dress up when you go to church. It makes things more intimidating, and makes people without nice clothes feel like church is not for them.



  • This is not my experience. Here's what I see:

    at the beach, shorts and sandals
    at church, shorts and sandals
    on the airlines, shorts and sandals
    in school, shorts and sandals
    in restaurants, shorts and sandals
    at weddings, shorts and sandals

    Sahid, there's lots of shorts and sandals and worship chorus churchs available. Many have Saturday night services as well.

    Your cliched list reads like something from the 1960s.
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    Sahid
    Megistered Rember




    Date Joined Jun 2004
    Total Posts : 2013
     
       Posted 8/10/2004 9:14 AM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
    I didn't say the it was a list of how all churches are. But there are quite a few churchs that still are that way. I attended one for eighteen years and about half of my friends in college came from one.


    Watch me fly. Freedom like wings and I will use them. Freedom like wings and I will spread them wide. - Stavesacre

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    1Heart
    Registered Member


    Date Joined Feb 2004
    Total Posts : 1128
     
       Posted 8/15/2004 5:56 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
    quote:
    Originally posted by Sahid

    I didn't say the it was a list of how all churches are. But there are quite a few churchs that still are that way. I attended one for eighteen years and about half of my friends in college came from one.



    Sahid,

    I'm part of a non-denom church with a very lively upbeat worship. I sing on the worship team, and I love it. The music is very community oriented for the most part...getting away from "me centered" worship. We usually start off with one of those wonderful 18th century hymns that teach wonderful theology (well, a lot of them anyway). A lot of them are very powerful, and still communicate wonderful things about God, and who we are in Him. Have you heard David Crowder (sp?) sing hymns, or Fernando Ortega? Old hymns can be made more appealing by how they are sang - different rhythm... We often liven up older hymns, and we need to remember that we have a "broad spectrum" as far as ages and theological backgrounds in our church. We try to make the praise/worship part of our service something that appeals to the whole community.

    I personally love songs such as God of Wonders. Recently we took sang a celtic chorus called "In Christ Alone" I love celtic music.

    Worship is individual, but on Sunday mornings it is community as well.

    God Bless,
    Jo-Anne Clown


    "Sometimes all we can do is go back to the character of God, and drop anchor there."

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