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feelinahole
Registered Member
Date Joined Jan 2004
Total Posts : 754
| Posted 5/1/2004 1:33 PM (GMT -6) |   | | ACtually, Borg, the fact that we are made in the image of God says much about how worthwhile we are. Oh, no, I have man-made philosophy! Get it off get it off! | | Back to Top | | |
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feelinahole
Registered Member
Date Joined Jan 2004
Total Posts : 754
| Posted 5/1/2004 2:02 PM (GMT -6) | | By the by, it should be noted that the simple fact that God spends so much time on humans, put in so much effort with us and all, should show that he considers us worthwhile. I mean, does he as much say so with the whole dying-on-the-cross thing? Does he REALLY havwe to come out and actually say it (although he does, actually)?
Finally, while the Bible does say much about the praise of God, I don't think, Borg, that God intends it at the debasement of humans. In other words, worshiping God does not mean we lower man. You seem to imply that in order to worship well, we must belittle ourselves. This simply is not true. God does not wish us belittled. He loves us and wishes the best for us. That is why we worship. | | Back to Top | | |
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selah
Registered Member
Date Joined Oct 2001
Total Posts : 1210
| Posted 5/1/2004 2:07 PM (GMT -6) | | quote:
Originally posted by borg
selah, to answer your first question: "I do not ask on behalf of these alone, but but for those also who believe in Me through their word: that they may all be one; even as You, Father, are in Me and I in You, that they also may be in Us, so that the world may believe that You sent Me. The glory which You have given Me I have given to them, that they may be one, just as We are one; I in them and You in Me, that they may be perfected in unity, so that the world may know that You sent Me, and loved them, even as You have loved Me. Father, I desire that they also, whom You have given Me, be with Me where I am, SO THAT THEY MAY SEE MY GLORY WHICH YOU HAVE GIVEN ME, for You loved Me before the foundation of the world. O righteous Father, although the world has not know You, yet I have known You; and these have known that You sent Me; and I have made Your name known to them, and will make it knowin so that the love with which You love Me may be in them, and I in them."
Wow borg, your part in caps amazed me! I see this prayer so opposite the way you see it. Sure, "so that may see my glory" is wonderful, but how about these things too:
"I do not ask on behalf of these alone, but for those also who believe in Me through their word: that they may all be one; even as You, Father, are in Me and I in You, that they also may be in Us, so that the world may believe that You sent Me. The glory which You have given Me I have given to them, that they may be one, just as We are one; I in them and You in Me, that they may be perfected in unity, so that the world may know that You sent Me, and loved them, even as You have loved Me. Father, I desire that they also, whom You have given Me, be with Me where I am, so that they may see my glory which you have given me, for You loved Me before the foundation of the world. O righteous Father, although the world has not know You, yet I have known You; and these have known that You sent Me; and I have made Your name known to them, and will make it knowin SO THAT THE LOVE WITH WHICH YOU LOVE ME MAY BE IN THEM, and I in them."
quote:
To me, that bleeds Jesus being glorified not us.
Well, soon after He prays that prayer (for us) He bleeds FOR US too, remember?
Borg, I'm sorry, I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree. I don't think I can move you toward His love and I don't think you can move me away from it. That's cool. We are still brothers and sisters right?
quote:
That's like me giving someone $10 so that they can buy me something nice (poor analogy I know, i just got up be nice).
I couldn't write an analogy IF someone gave me $10 to do it, so no worries :) I'll be nice!
love
selah
"When we acknowledge that all of life is sacred and that each act is an act of choice and therefore sacred, then life is a sacred dance lived consciously each moment. When we live at this level, we participate in the creation of a better world."
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