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|  Tigress Registered Member
 Date Joined Feb 2003 Total Posts : 1252 | Posted 5/15/2003 11:05 AM (GMT -6) |   | Okay, here's a headache-inducing question - at least for me anyway. I always pray every night that God will provide me with a husband. But, how in the world is God even able to do that, considering the guy of course has free will to choose for or against me to be his wife? Plus, I wouldn't want a man who was marrying me just because he wanted to obey God. I'd want him to truly want me. Yet, if God really is able to say yes to my prayer, how is that possible? Instead of commanding the guy to marry me, does He strongly persuade him or something? Does He change his heart or something? But changing the guy's heart sounds perilously close to controlling his will - don't ya think?
I had two friends who both believed that God wanted them to be married to each other because of these specific signs they asked God to reveal to them. And let me tell you, these tests contained so much criteria to determine who their spouse was to be, that the fact that all of them checked out truly was miraculous! So, it really did seem like God meant for them to marry each other. Anyway, the guy said he really wasn't all that attracted to her at all, until God changed his heart toward her. I think this all happened after he found out that God wanted him to marry her. But, to me this seems so unfair. It seems like God would provide someone that you were excited about right from the get-go.
A side note: These two friends of mine are now divorced. Go figure.
Tigress
The Angel of the Lord encamps around those who fear Him, and He delivers them. -Psalm 34:7 | | Back to Top | | |
 |  ReasonableDoubt Registered Member
 Date Joined Jan 2003 Total Posts : 655 | Posted 5/15/2003 11:11 AM (GMT -6) |   | Well this question is applicable to any prayer you may have. Say you pray for a specific job. Well, isn't that asking God to interfere with the free will of the employer? Or you pray for a nonchristian friend or relative - again you're asking God to intervene.
And say you get married. How do you know that god is the one who provided the husband? Considering that over 93% of adult americans have been married at least once, it seems like a pretty good bet you will get married. How will you know why though? | | Back to Top | | |
 |  Tigress Registered Member
 Date Joined Feb 2003 Total Posts : 1252 | Posted 5/15/2003 11:16 AM (GMT -6) |   | quote:
Well this question is applicable to any prayer you may have. Say you pray for a specific job. Well, isn't that asking God to interfere with the free will of the employer? Or you pray for a nonchristian friend or relative - again you're asking God to intervene.
And say you get married. How do you know that god is the one who provided the husband? Considering that over 93% of adult americans have been married at least once, it seems like a pretty good bet you will get married. How will you know why though?
Well, considering I haven't been asked out on a date since 1997 I think it's pretty likely that the one guy who does ask me to marry him will have been sent from God! 
Tigress
The Angel of the Lord encamps around those who fear Him, and He delivers them. -Psalm 34:7 | | Back to Top | | |
 |  S.B.G. Registered Member
 Date Joined Jan 2003 Total Posts : 143 | Posted 5/15/2003 11:43 AM (GMT -6) |   | "A side note: These two friends of mine are now divorced. Go figure."
Tigress,
LOL!
I am a firm believer that there has to be some level of physical attraction & sparks, not just comfort, safety, & "we're both in the Lord." There are a lot of things you can enjoy with your "brother", but marriage isn't one of them!
True, happy marriage is when you marry the person who is both your best friend and your lover. As you pray for a husband, I think God knows the type of person who would best suit you and he will orchestrate situations for you to meet various people who could be good husbands for you. It's up to the both of you to determine if there is compatibility and chemistry, but I do think God puts people in our paths, with the possibility that we will develop relationships.
I don't think there is ONE person who was specifically made for you, but there are personalities, thought processes, and physical characteristics that will compliment you and fill your needs.
I don't think the work that God has to do is changing our hearts to develop feelings that aren't there (like your friend's situation) Falling in love shouldn't have to be that hard!!
Couples need to learn how to recognize each other's needs, how to communicate and how to "do" relationships. Developing the relationship requires effort and understanding. Two excellent books that have ministered to me are “His needs, Her Needs” by Bill Harley and “The Five Love Languages”---I don’t know who wrote that one. But they are both very beneficial and I wish more people understood these concepts as they were developing their relationship instead of trying to rescue them!
You have my prayers. I think you are an intelligent, interesting person and soon the right guy will see it too!
S.B.G.
To understand and to be understood is bliss. | | Back to Top | | |
 |  Laplace Registered Member
 Date Joined Apr 2003 Total Posts : 138 | Posted 5/15/2003 12:22 PM (GMT -6) |   | My brief analysis on Marriage and the will of God:
- Although I'd like to believe in the more romantic "God has one specific person for me" viewpoint, I don't believe it's Biblical. However to be fair, I don't have sufficient evidence to say it isn't the case. Just a preponderence of the evidence gives more weight towards the latter than the former.
- People get really hung up over the question "Does God want me married?". The 1 Cor 7 chapter has been used (and abused) by both sides to push their opinion on whether to be "actively seeking" a mate or not. Taken to one extreme it presumes God's will completely and negates personal responsibility (analogous to saying, "If God wants me to do well on the upcoming test, I will, so I need not study for it. If I fail, well, it wasn't God's will for me to pass."). Taken to the other extreme though is idolatrous.
- Emotions (or that "feeling") can be a good confirmer of decisions, but are bad to act on them alone and can be disasterous (such as in your friends' case). You can FEEL that it's OK to have sex before marriage, FEEL that's it's OK to divorce under less-than-Biblical reasons, etc. but we know the FACT that it's not OK. The point is that emotions are just one piece of the puzzle. "Signs" can also be misinterpreted. Not saying they don't exist, but use caution if they are your litmus test.
Conclusion:
Be honest with God, and don't feel ashamed to pray specifically for a godly lifelong mate. It is a GOOD thing. And don't be afraid to "make opportunities" for God to work. Go to social events. Strike up conversation. No, there are no guarentees that you will get what you ultimately desire. But I can with confidence say that if you seek God first (doesn't mean you aren't seeking other things too, just a matter of priority), and look at the positives in your situation NOW (difficult being single, I know), it will make life much more enjoyable.
Hope this helps.
"Balance in all things" - Dak'kon, Planescape Torment
Edited by - Laplace on 05/15/2003 5:23:56 PM | | Back to Top | | |
 |  Starkman Registered Member

Date Joined Oct 2001 Total Posts : 1747 | Posted 5/15/2003 12:55 PM (GMT -6) |   | Maybe our praying itself says something more to God than, "God, provide me the person you have (already) in mind for me." Maybe it says, "God, I'm asking for your help in this issue. How about adding your touch to help this along."
Does this mean God's going to make someone love you? Heaven's no, but what if that guy has been praying too? Isn't he also praying that God would help him along. So, God says, "Hey, check this gal out. You know, you could really learn (and grow) to love her if you are willing." He's simply helping, not making. In other instances, maybe he's got some plans already made and just asks the couple to go along with it, be obedient and reap the benefit. (God can ask us to do what He wants, even when it comes to whom we marry, if He feels it important enough.)
Starkman
Am I right? I say, am I right? Charlie Brown | | Back to Top | | |
 |  DLW Registered Member
 Date Joined Apr 2003 Total Posts : 2457 | Posted 5/15/2003 2:49 PM (GMT -6) |   | I think the question also falls under the "Is Open Theism Really Scarier" link.
Openness regarding whether we meet and marry someone and whether that marriage succeeds sucks. It is a big potential source of angst and yet the remarks of others are true and we still do hope in God.
dlw
Prayer from Kenya
From the Cowardice that dare not face new truth, From the Laziness that is contented with half-truth, From the Arrogance that thinks it knows all truth, Lord Deliver Me. | | Back to Top | | |
 |  Starkman Registered Member

Date Joined Oct 2001 Total Posts : 1747 | Posted 5/15/2003 2:58 PM (GMT -6) |   | DWL, it couldn't have been said any better! Ain't it the truth!
Starkman
Am I right? I say, am I right? Charlie Brown | | Back to Top | | |
 |  Terry_Baxter Registered Member
 Date Joined Jan 2002 Total Posts : 187 | Posted 5/15/2003 6:51 PM (GMT -6) |   | Hey Tigress,
You may want someone with a pastor's heart to respond to your question. That isn't me. I can give you a discussion board--intellectual response, though.
Yes, I think prayer can change God's mind. Check out Gen 18.23ff, for one example.
I do think prayer can move things in this world even when it is already God's will to do something (how, why and when this happens is something of a mystery to me, but it is based on the idea of that spiritual warfare is real and we participate in that). Just like praying for a job during an economic depression is tough, praying for a husband when so many men are addicted to the skinny/beautiful image of women in the media (and so many women are addicted to the romantic notions of love in the media) is difficult. But with God...
It's also possible that God would lead you together (as He may have your friends) and then you and your new husband/boyfriend don't do the right things to stay together (as your friends may not have done). In other words, just because God led him to you, doesn't mean the work is done in making a lasting, happy marriage.
Here's another encouragement: how often do you pray something like, "God, what can I do to be more ready to meet a spouse?" or "What do want to change in me to make me the bride a husband would love to have?" or even, "God, you know how freakin desperately I want a husband (or a date!), can you please help me with this desire and begin to remove it if you don't want me to be married!"?
Finally, I know some people who pray for, say, a job, but then never apply for any jobs. There are real world things we can do and we need to be wise about that. (Lu 16:8)
I encourage you to keep praying (MT 11:12; LU 11:5-13).
Terry "As a disclaimer to everything I've ever said or everything I ever will say, when it's all said and done we'll only have two things left to say: One is `Forgive me' and the other is `Thank you."' --Rich Mullins
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 |  selah Registered Member

Date Joined Oct 2001 Total Posts : 1210 | Posted 5/15/2003 10:38 PM (GMT -6) |   | Tigress,
I can relate. I've been single for a long time and hardly ever date. I know I joke about it a lot, but I sure don't move toward anyone who tries to start a dating relationship. Sometimes, I think I just get so comfortable in my relationship with God I feel satisfied and almost forget I'm single. Other times, like now at 3AM, I wish I had someone to wake up and help me with my finals! or... well, you know what I mean.
One thing I realized from your post is that I should remember to keep praying for this! *duh* To me, prayer is asking God to have influence in a certain area. In fact, I believe the more you pray (ask God to have influence) the less influence "not God" can have. This is productive. Prayer avails much!
Thanks for sharing your story. I hear ya. love selah PS.Terry, thanks for this convicting note: quote: Finally, I know some people who pray for, say, a job, but then never apply for any jobs. There are real world things we can do and we need to be wise about that. (Lu 16:8)
It's true, sometime's we need to say YES and spend TIME dating. I guess. I value my time so much, it's hard for me to say "yes" to a man asking for a date...unless he is in shining armor and on a white horse or something 
Then He showed me the river whose waters give life, sparkling like crystal, flowing out from the throne of God and of the Lamb. Rev. 22:1 | | Back to Top | | |
 |  Laika Registered Member

Date Joined Mar 2003 Total Posts : 2433 | Posted 5/16/2003 5:13 AM (GMT -6) |   | Tigress, two words:
Green Card
You're welcome.

Even though the skies are blue, don't they let the sunshine through? | | Back to Top | | |
 |  DLW Registered Member
 Date Joined Apr 2003 Total Posts : 2457 | Posted 5/16/2003 5:28 AM (GMT -6) |   | quote:
Tigress, two words:
Green Card
You're welcome.
So Laika, Is that how you got married? dlw
Prayer from Kenya
From the Cowardice that dare not face new truth, From the Laziness that is contented with half-truth, From the Arrogance that thinks it knows all truth, Lord Deliver Me. | | Back to Top | | |
 |  Laika Registered Member

Date Joined Mar 2003 Total Posts : 2433 | Posted 5/16/2003 5:32 AM (GMT -6) |   | quote:
quote:
Tigress, two words:
Green Card
You're welcome.
So Laika, Is that how you got married? dlw
No, the only problem I had to overcome was a restraining order.

Even though the skies are blue, don't they let the sunshine through? | | Back to Top | | |
 |  Tigress Registered Member
 Date Joined Feb 2003 Total Posts : 1252 | Posted 5/16/2003 6:39 AM (GMT -6) |   | LOL! You people are hilarious! (We need a smiley face that shows laughter!)
Seriously, though. To me there is a deeper issue here. Is this an area where God really has no ultimate control? I mean God could bring to me all His choices of a husband for me but they could all very well say no. The Bible says that God is our provider for all things. Yet, if a person really needs to be married, God cannot really guarantee that He can provide a spouse for someone, according to this. What if a person truly wants and needs a spouse and God truly wants for them to have one, but each of the people He brings to them say no? This seems to contradict the Truth that God can and does provide all good things to His children.
Tigress
The Angel of the Lord encamps around those who fear Him, and He delivers them. -Psalm 34:7 | | Back to Top | | |
 |  might-be-don Registered Member
 Date Joined Jun 2001 Total Posts : 830 | Posted 5/16/2003 7:08 AM (GMT -6) |   | quote: This seems to contradict the Truth that God can and does provide all good things to His children.
If you search the archives you would find that much talk has been made over suffering being a good thing. So maybe there is no contradiction.
peace and love, don
--- "No Rules, just Right" Outback Steakhouse | | Back to Top | | |
 |  Laika Registered Member

Date Joined Mar 2003 Total Posts : 2433 | Posted 5/16/2003 7:21 AM (GMT -6) |   | Tigress
quote:
Seriously, though. To me there is a deeper issue here. Is this an area where God really has no ultimate control? I mean God could bring to me all His choices of a husband for me but they could all very well say no. The Bible says that God is our provider for all things. Yet, if a person really needs to be married, God cannot really guarantee that He can provide a spouse for someone, according to this. What if a person truly wants and needs a spouse and God truly wants for them to have one, but each of the people He brings to them say no? This seems to contradict the Truth that God can and does provide all good things to His children.
This is a tough question. I have a friend in his late forties who wants to be married but hasn't found someone yet. I think he's been too picky and not willing to modify some things about himself AND he did pass up two great gals and I think he regrets that. Some matches are better than others but the bottom line is a marriage relationship takes sacrifice, giving and work on the parts of both people.
God did answer one specific prayer I had when I was considering courting my wife so praying is a very valid technique. Happily married 21 1/2 years now.

Even though the skies are blue, don't they let the sunshine through? | | Back to Top | | |
 |  S.B.G. Registered Member
 Date Joined Jan 2003 Total Posts : 143 | Posted 5/16/2003 7:29 AM (GMT -6) |   | Laika,
What a touching and wise post.
Relationships take time to develop and a willingness to work at it and yes, change flaws that are detrimental to the relationship. My husband says he doesn't know what I see in him, but to me he is the most beautiful person I know.
Bless your sweet heart, Laika! Keep lovin' on that wife of yours!  S.B.G.
To understand and to be understood is bliss. | | Back to Top | | |
 |  Laika Registered Member

Date Joined Mar 2003 Total Posts : 2433 | Posted 5/16/2003 7:33 AM (GMT -6) |   | quote:
Bless your sweet heart, Laika! Keep lovin' on that wife of yours!  S.B.G.
Thank you. If I can catch her, I'll still keep lovin' her.
Her mom is in an Alzheimer's home and when I visit I often see an old couple sitting there, I think the man comes in to visit his wife and they just SIT there, side by side. I've never seen them talk. I always have to hurry on past so I don't start blubbering.

Even though the skies are blue, don't they let the sunshine through? | | Back to Top | | |
 |  S.B.G. Registered Member
 Date Joined Jan 2003 Total Posts : 143 | Posted 5/16/2003 7:39 AM (GMT -6) |   | Laika,
That's so sweet!
You're making me cry just talking about it!
S.B.G.
To understand and to be understood is bliss. | | Back to Top | | |
 |  Laika Registered Member

Date Joined Mar 2003 Total Posts : 2433 | Posted 5/16/2003 7:54 AM (GMT -6) |   | quote:
Laika,
That's so sweet!
You're making me cry just talking about it!
S.B.G.
Sorry. I got my mother's tender heart. I cry at Hallmark ads on T.V.
Tigress Here's my view on marriage. Let me talk about careers and immigrants first. I'm often impressed by some immigrants, how they start out in a real bad situation, come to this country and seizing whatever economic activity they can (that's not illegal or immoral) succeed. In other words, they bloom where they're planted. They don't say, "I wish I could be a ballet star", they seize whatever opportunity presents itself and run with it. On the other hand, some native born people, such as myself, have specific dreams, that are often unrealisitc. We pine away and wait for the perfect opportunity and it never comes. We don't seize the available opportunities because that might lead us away from our perfect little dreams.
Marriage is like this. Many people wait around for the ideal mate that they've created in their heads/imaginations. NO ONE meets this ideal so they continue to wait, letting opportunities go by. I know some people (Japanese) who had arranged marriages and you know, they MAKE it work. I'm not suggesting an arranged marriage but the principle is there. Don't wait for an impossible ideal, seize an opportunity and make it work.
Egads, that's enough seriousness for one afternoon.

Even though the skies are blue, don't they let the sunshine through? | | Back to Top | | |
 |  Tigress Registered Member
 Date Joined Feb 2003 Total Posts : 1252 | Posted 5/16/2003 8:02 AM (GMT -6) |   | quote:
quote: This seems to contradict the Truth that God can and does provide all good things to His children.
If you search the archives you would find that much talk has been made over suffering being a good thing. So maybe there is no contradiction.
peace and love, don
--- "No Rules, just Right" Outback Steakhouse
AAAAARRRRRRRRGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!! I wanna husband!!!!!!!!!!!!
Tigress
The Angel of the Lord encamps around those who fear Him, and He delivers them. -Psalm 34:7 | | Back to Top | | |
 |  Laika Registered Member

Date Joined Mar 2003 Total Posts : 2433 | Posted 5/16/2003 8:06 AM (GMT -6) |   | Tigress ponders:
quote:
AAAAARRRRRRRRGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!! I wanna husband!!!!!!!!!!!!
http://bride.ru
There's a section for hubbies.

Even though the skies are blue, don't they let the sunshine through? | | Back to Top | | |
 |  One Love Registered Member

Date Joined Jan 2003 Total Posts : 13888 | Posted 5/16/2003 8:09 AM (GMT -6) |   | An aside. Three words.
Pre. Marital. Counseling.
Don't get married without LOTS of it, throughly done. Ounce of prevention is a pound of cure. Nuff said.
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 |  S.B.G. Registered Member
 Date Joined Jan 2003 Total Posts : 143 | Posted 5/16/2003 8:17 AM (GMT -6) |   | quote:
An aside. Three words.
Pre. Marital. Counseling.
Don't get married without LOTS of it, throughly done. Ounce of prevention is a pound of cure. Nuff said.

YES, YES, YES!!!
I'd recommend TNT counseling, not all counseling is equal.
S.B.G.
To understand and to be understood is bliss. | | Back to Top | | |
 |  BJS Registered Member
 Date Joined Dec 2001 Total Posts : 587 | Posted 5/16/2003 8:23 AM (GMT -6) |   | quote:
Well this question is applicable to any prayer you may have. Say you pray for a specific job. Well, isn't that asking God to interfere with the free will of the employer? Or you pray for a nonchristian friend or relative - again you're asking God to intervene.
Just a quick thought. As a determinist, Gina, what exactly do you pray for? That God will do what God has already decided to do from the beginning of time? 
Brett
"Siste viator et memento mori." | | Back to Top | | |
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