 |
| 
archive
Registered Member
Date Joined Jun 2001
Total Posts : 516
| Posted 6/28/2001 5:21 PM (GMT -6) |   | Message
Yofu
05/07/01 12:05 AM
Question number 1
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
First a note - I seem to be having problems with the formatting of messages on this discussion board. If the following is difficult to read, I apologize, and invite you to help me figure out how to get line breaks to work on this message board system.
Question number 1:
Do teh philosophical quest for ultimate reality and the Biblical revelation of God point us to the same thing or to two different things?
-Yofu
Posted Originally From: Open Theism Information Site
Ephesians3_20
05/07/01 2:52 AM
RE: Question number 1
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes, the Biblical revelation of God is Ultimate Reality.
~Am I walking into something here?
*Ephesians 3_20*
(formerly known as Proverbs, although Proverbs 23_23 still lives within me )
Posted Originally From: Christus Victor Ministries
Yofu
05/07/01 8:16 AM
RE: RE: Question number 1
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
No, you're not walking into anything. This is one of the questions I have been exploring lately in my own thought life...
Why do you feel that the God revealed by the bible is the same reality as that being searched for in the Philosophical quest?
-Kris
Posted Originally From: Open Theism Information Site
Wislawa
05/07/01 9:42 AM
RE: Question number 1
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Good question Yofu. I would argue that they can’t be 100% the same but that they do overlap and complement each other. In the philosophical tradition truth is found through a sort of narcissism of the Same. That is to say truth is like an old poem that we had memorized but have forgotten. We do not need revelation, what we need is to remember our memories. With Biblical revelation we know can gain access to things beyond ourselves, things we would have never dreamt of. In the philosophical tradition no truth will every surprise us. All truth will have the effect of “OF COURSE” I have always known this, but now I know I know this. With revelation God rips us a new hole as the kids say. He gives us genuine surprising information about Himself, us and the world that we would never have gotten through self-reflection.
In the end we need both traditions to get at reality, to deny one of them is to deny half of our access to truth. Much like denying women the opportunity to lead us denies us half of what we have been given. But that’s another thread.
—Wislawa
Posted Originally From: Open Theism Information Site
Mephi2K
05/07/01 9:55 AM
Response from Meph
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Say, Wis. Just a thought. I would agree with your statement, but I think you may be missing Yofu's true question. I could very well be wrong. To me, Yofu's question was more along the lines of asking is there a primal UNITY of truth. I don't think he's asking which path to truth is superior or anything like that. He is asking do both of the paths of garnering knowledge point to the SAME ONE REALITY...or do the two paths lead to divergent conclusions. Am I right about that, Yofu?
My answer: Yes, they do point to the same reality. (When I use the word 'reality', I am speaking of how things truly are, not how their are perceived.) See ToM J. Calvin on the Unity of Truth.
PS: Welcome, Yofu. It's a pleasure meeting you.
Meph
Posted Originally From: Christus Victor Ministries
Wislawa
05/07/01 10:06 AM
RE: Response from Meph
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hey M2K I think your right. I did miss the core of the question after all. I’m trying to write so many responses in so little time. You know how that goes. Anyway I would agree with you that the two realities are united. But in what way are they united? Are they united in the way that they are identical? Or might they be two faces of the same coin? Or something more complicated? I have a hard time imagining them being identical but who knows.
—Wislawa
Posted Originally From: Open Theism Information Site
Yofu
05/07/01 7:41 PM
RE: RE: Response from Meph
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hi Wisliwa...
Whether or not you missed my "point" in your first response, I found your first response to be really significant to the line of thought into which I am currently searching. Your characterization of the philosophical quest as a kind of "remembering" and the religious journey as a real "revealing" was very exciting to me - both jiving with my personal experience and also helping to clarify my own thoughts on the subject of late. Thank you for that!
Now, my next question for you and everyone else (actually, more of hte same question) is *why* do you think taht ultimately the Biblical revelation and the philosophical quest are pointing to the same reality? (Or at least, to two "united" realities as you put it.)
What is it in the biblical revelation which leads you to see it as pointing to the ultimate reality of the philosophical quest? What is it in the philosophical quest which leads you to see it as ultimately pointing to the God of the biblical revelation?
Aren't these questions fuuun?
-Yofu
Message
Yofu
05/07/01 12:05 AM
Question number 1
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
First a note - I seem to be having problems with the formatting of messages on this discussion board. If the following is difficult to read, I apologize, and invite you to help me figure out how to get line breaks to work on this message board system.
Question number 1:
Do teh philosophical quest for ultimate reality and the Biblical revelation of God point us to the same thing or to two different things?
-Yofu
Posted Originally From: Open Theism Information Site
Ephesians3_20
05/07/01 2:52 AM
RE: Question number 1
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes, the Biblical revelation of God is Ultimate Reality.
~Am I walking into something here?
*Ephesians 3_20*
(formerly known as Proverbs, although Proverbs 23_23 still lives within me )
Posted Originally From: Christus Victor Ministries
Yofu
05/07/01 8:16 AM
RE: RE: Question number 1
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
No, you're not walking into anything. This is one of the questions I have been exploring lately in my own thought life...
Why do you feel that the God revealed by the bible is the same reality as that being searched for in the Philosophical quest?
-Kris
Posted Originally From: Open Theism Information Site
Wislawa
05/07/01 9:42 AM
RE: Question number 1
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Good question Yofu. I would argue that they can’t be 100% the same but that they do overlap and complement each other. In the philosophical tradition truth is found through a sort of narcissism of the Same. That is to say truth is like an old poem that we had memorized but have forgotten. We do not need revelation, what we need is to remember our memories. With Biblical revelation we know can gain access to things beyond ourselves, things we would have never dreamt of. In the philosophical tradition no truth will every surprise us. All truth will have the effect of “OF COURSE” I have always known this, but now I know I know this. With revelation God rips us a new hole as the kids say. He gives us genuine surprising information about Himself, us and the world that we would never have gotten through self-reflection.
In the end we need both traditions to get at reality, to deny one of them is to deny half of our access to truth. Much like denying women the opportunity to lead us denies us half of what we have been given. But that’s another thread.
—Wislawa
Posted Originally From: Open Theism Information Site
Mephi2K
05/07/01 9:55 AM
Response from Meph
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Say, Wis. Just a thought. I would agree with your statement, but I think you may be missing Yofu's true question. I could very well be wrong. To me, Yofu's question was more along the lines of asking is there a primal UNITY of truth. I don't think he's asking which path to truth is superior or anything like that. He is asking do both of the paths of garnering knowledge point to the SAME ONE REALITY...or do the two paths lead to divergent conclusions. Am I right about that, Yofu?
My answer: Yes, they do point to the same reality. (When I use the word 'reality', I am speaking of how things truly are, not how their are perceived.) See ToM J. Calvin on the Unity of Truth.
PS: Welcome, Yofu. It's a pleasure meeting you.
Meph
Posted Originally From: Christus Victor Ministries
Wislawa
05/07/01 10:06 AM
RE: Response from Meph
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hey M2K I think your right. I did miss the core of the question after all. I’m trying to write so many responses in so little time. You know how that goes. Anyway I would agree with you that the two realities are united. But in what way are they united? Are they united in the way that they are identical? Or might they be two faces of the same coin? Or something more complicated? I have a hard time imagining them being identical but who knows.
—Wislawa
Posted Originally From: Open Theism Information Site
Yofu
05/07/01 7:41 PM
RE: RE: Response from Meph
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hi Wisliwa...
Whether or not you missed my "point" in your first response, I found your first response to be really significant to the line of thought into which I am currently searching. Your characterization of the philosophical quest as a kind of "remembering" and the religious journey as a real "revealing" was very exciting to me - both jiving with my personal experience and also helping to clarify my own thoughts on the subject of late. Thank you for that!
Now, my next question for you and everyone else (actually, more of hte same question) is *why* do you think taht ultimately the Biblical revelation and the philosophical quest are pointing to the same reality? (Or at least, to two "united" realities as you put it.)
What is it in the biblical revelation which leads you to see it as pointing to the ultimate reality of the philosophical quest? What is it in the philosophical quest which leads you to see it as ultimately pointing to the God of the biblical revelation?
Aren't these questions fuuun?
-Yofu
| | Back to Top | | |
 | Forum Information | Currently it is Monday, November 09, 2026 5:53 PM (GMT -6)
There are a total of 97,718 posts in 6,040 threads.
In the last 3 days there were 0 new threads and 0 reply posts. View Active Threads
|
Forum powered by dotNetBB v2.42EC SP3
dotNetBB © 2000-2026 |
|
|