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JCF
Registered Member
Date Joined Sep 2004
Total Posts : 10
| Posted 9/8/2004 7:36 PM (GMT -6) |   | God is omniscient and knows all possibilities as if it was the only possibility. He knows all the infinite complex outcomes possible, including the chaos theory’s natural systems, down to the effect of the slightest flutter of a butterfly’s wings. A large output from a small input. He knows all possible consequences for any free moral agents' choices and actions. Knowing how sensitive the smallest initial changes can alter cause and effect. Would he know, if under any series of events that someone would choose Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior if any one small factor were changed before their death?
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1Heart
Registered Member
Date Joined Feb 2004
Total Posts : 1128
| Posted 9/8/2004 10:13 PM (GMT -6) | | quote:
Originally posted by JCF
God is omniscient and knows all possibilities as if it was the only possibility. He knows all the infinite complex outcomes possible, including the chaos theory’s natural systems, down to the effect of the slightest flutter of a butterfly’s wings. A large output from a small input. He knows all possible consequences for any free moral agents' choices and actions. Knowing how sensitive the smallest initial changes can alter cause and effect. Would he know, if under any series of events that someone would choose Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior if any one small factor were changed before their death?
I can only offer my thoughts, and my view of the Father; how I see Him, and how He sees me. I'm sure you'll get much more theological responses than mine. He knows my thoughts. I believe that He knows me intimately as a lover knows His beloved. He knows what will persuade me, what is likely to influence me. He knows how to "reach" my heart, how to speak to me. He is closer to me than my breath. With that kind of intimacy, how could He NOT know - and yet, He loves me far too much to coerce me. He is a gentle lover. He chose to create that way, and give us this amazing gift of free will - that would enable us to experience real love, and give real love, and choose to grow in loving relationship with the Creator.
Did that answer your question? I guess I answered your question, with a question: How could He NOT know?
My thoughts,
God Bless,
Jo-Anne 
"Sometimes all we can do is go back to the character of God, and drop anchor there."
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JCF
Registered Member
Date Joined Sep 2004
Total Posts : 10
| Posted 9/10/2004 9:47 AM (GMT -6) | | quote:
Originally posted by moon_river_j
I can only offer my thoughts, and my view of the Father; how I see Him, and how He sees me. I'm sure you'll get much more theological responses than mine. He knows my thoughts. I believe that He knows me intimately as a lover knows His beloved. He knows what will persuade me, what is likely to influence me. He knows how to "reach" my heart, how to speak to me. He is closer to me than my breath. With that kind of intimacy, how could He NOT know - and yet, He loves me far too much to coerce me. He is a gentle lover. He chose to create that way, and give us this amazing gift of free will - that would enable us to experience real love, and give real love, and choose to grow in loving relationship with the Creator.
Did that answer your question? I guess I answered your question, with a question: How could He NOT know?
My thoughts,
God Bless,
Jo-Anne
Thanks for your response, Moon.
You said "God knows how to reach your heart, how to speak to you, that He knows what will persuade and influence you." Do you believe God does this for everyone, or only a few special elected people? I would suspect your answer would be that we have to choose God first before he reveals Himself in such a manner. So with all that said, did something happen in your life that led you to the decision to choose God? What do you think your eternal security was before you made that choice? You say “how could He not know”. So then, what would have happened to your soul, if you had died before you gave your life to the Lord?
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Leviathan
Registered Member
Date Joined Sep 2004
Total Posts : 82
| Posted 9/10/2004 10:11 AM (GMT -6) | | Moon...
I chopped your words...now find someone to add the music and you will have a wonderful song!!!
I offer my thoughts; and view the Father;
How I see Him, and how He sees me.
He knows my thoughts.
He knows me intimately as a lover knows His beloved.
He knows what will persuade me, what will influence me.
He knows how to "reach" my heart.
He is closer to me than my breath.
What kind of intimacy, how could He NOT know.
He loves me far too much to coerce me.
He is a gentle lover.
He chose to create that way, amazing gift of free will.
Experience real love, give real love, grow in loving relationship with the Creator.
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Truth Aficionado
Registered Member
Date Joined Dec 2003
Total Posts : 1544
| Posted 9/23/2004 4:52 PM (GMT -6) | | quote:
Originally posted by JCF
God is omniscient and knows all possibilities as if it was the only possibility. He knows all the infinite complex outcomes possible, including the chaos theory’s natural systems, down to the effect of the slightest flutter of a butterfly’s wings. A large output from a small input. He knows all possible consequences for any free moral agents' choices and actions. Knowing how sensitive the smallest initial changes can alter cause and effect. Would he know, if under any series of events that someone would choose Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior if any one small factor were changed before their death?
I dug the following up about babies going to heaven, maybe it will help.
"Those who believe in predestination believe that God already knows what the child would have chosen (hell or heaven) and the soul of the baby will be sent to that location accordingly"
Comment by Empiress 2002 Feb 08
"I agree with Empiress' comment on the most part, but also think that it is possible for God to know what the baby would have chosen even if predestination wasn't true, as many believe that God's knowledge of the future does not imply that the future is predestined, but merely that an omniscient God knows every possible outcome no matter which way the course of events go. If this is true, it seems that life and suffering is pointless. Because if God can do this with babies, it can do it with all beings. Therefore, God could not allow anyone to exist who would choose hell, and therefore reduce all suffering in hell. If God is benevolent, this is what it would do. If all beings that exist do go to heaven, then what is the point of the suffering of life? Why does God not simply put everyone in heaven immediately? This problem means that it can't be true that God places babies in heaven/Hell according to what they would have chosen in life." Comment by Vexen 2002 | | Back to Top | | |
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Starkman
Registered Member
Date Joined Oct 2001
Total Posts : 1747
| Posted 9/24/2004 6:32 AM (GMT -6) | | quote:
God is omniscient and knows all possibilities as if it was the only possibility. He knows all the infinite complex outcomes possible, including the chaos theory’s natural systems, down to the effect of the slightest flutter of a butterfly’s wings. A large output from a small input. He knows all possible consequences for any free moral agents' choices and actions. Knowing how sensitive the smallest initial changes can alter cause and effect. Would he know, if under any series of events that someone would choose Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior if any one small factor were changed before their death?
Hey JCF,
I think you've read into God's omniscience more than what it claims. Here's the general definition of God's omniscience: God knows all truth values and believes no falsehoods. He knows what is determined as will and will not; He knows what is conditional as might or might not. He knows when conditionals change to determines.
For us to insist that God knows every possible outcome is to short-circuit the conditionals--the mights and might nots--f God's omniscience. What we should say is that it is possible that something will result in something else, which will result in something else, etc, but that is all we can say. Therefore, it is not accurate to assess a complete "history of the world," if you will, in view of God's omniscience. We'd be right back to something similar to Arminianism, where God knows everything, and, because of that, the future is thus determined.
Hoping for clarity,
Starkman | | Back to Top | | |
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