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AtTheWell
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Date Joined Nov 2004
Total Posts : 133
 
   Posted 2/25/2005 8:06 AM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Thanks for the things to think about Lee.


Peace,
ATW

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JEE
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Date Joined Jul 2004
Total Posts : 1466
 
   Posted 2/25/2005 11:03 AM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.

I'm not a determinist, I don't believe that every action could be predicted, if we just fully knew all about the present.

 

For the umpteenth time, Jesus’ prediction of Peter’s denial was not ONLY based on His perfect knowledge of the present.

 

Believers are in the will of God, and I don't believe God's will is constricted, where there's always and only one inevitable outcome, based on the circumstances.

Okay, then you are an Open Theist, by definition (indeterminist).


2 Corinthians
3:17 Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is ... freedom!

 

Where is the Spirit of the Lord NOT?

 

Certainly the crowing of the rooster could have be easily predicted, but predicting Peter's memory at the moment of the first rooster crow is not so easy! Not to mention the doorkeeper deciding to let him in, and the soldier deciding not to arrest him...

 


John: Jesus had perfect knowledge of Peter’s character and what Peter would do under pressure if put in certain situations such as this.



Lee: Then that's definite knowledge of the future!

 

No, it is perfect knowledge of Peter’s CHARACTER.


 
P.S. I'm off to Texas for the weekend, it may be next Tuesday before I can check for any further discussing…

 

 

Sounds good. All my exes live in Texas.


May the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit.


JohnE


http://revivaltheology.net

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Lee Merrill
booted




Date Joined Jun 2001
Total Posts : 723
 
   Posted 3/1/2005 10:18 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Hi everyone,

Back again! I was just playing an organ music CD. Bach again…

various folks said...
Lee: I'm not a determinist, I don't believe that every action could be predicted, if we just fully knew all about the present.

John: Jesus’ prediction of Peter’s denial was not ONLY based on His perfect knowledge of the present.


Well, perfect knowledge of his present character, isn't that the Open View's stand here?

various folks said...
Lee: Believers are in the will of God, and I don't believe God's will is constricted, where there's always and only one inevitable outcome, based on the circumstances.

John: Okay, then you are an Open Theist, by definition (indeterminist).


Sorry, I meant that the past doesn't cause the present, in and of itself, but not that it's up in the air, from God's perspective. But that's another topic!

John said...
2 Corinthians 3:17 Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is ... freedom!

John: Where is the Spirit of the Lord NOT?


Well, in the above sense, I don't think he is in unbelievers, though he is present in some way everywhere ("Where can I flee from your presence" - Ps. 139), he is not present in the "freedom" sense in unsaved people ("Who do not have the Spirit" - Jude 1:19, also Rom. 8:9 could be mentioned).

various folks said...
John: Jesus had perfect knowledge of Peter’s character and what Peter would do under pressure if put in certain situations such as this.

Lee: Then that's definite knowledge of the future!

John: No, it is perfect knowledge of Peter’s CHARACTER.


It's both! If Peter's character gives definite knowledge of his actions…

And how about that doorkeeper?

Blessings,
Lee


==================================================
"Even now we seem to have dim glimpses into regions
from which we receive no word to bring away" (George MacDonald)

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