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cpoteet
Registered Member
Date Joined Dec 2004
Total Posts : 35
| Posted 12/25/2004 5:04 PM (GMT -6) |   | Dr. Boyd,
I am writing of desperation. I was hoping I could visit this message board and challenge Open Theists to re-think the very view they hold of God. It seems as though the work I have done here has been to no avail.
Now, it should be noted I have been less than edifying in how I staged my arguments, and I apologize for anyone on this board that I may offended. I feel strongly that God is in danger, and I sought out whatever means possible to save Him. But I have seen the folly of my ways, I must not contradict myself in that I believe God is completely sovereign (in that He has planned the ends as well as the means) and trust that He will work in this arena.
I challenge you Dr. Boyd to save God. Bring Him back to who He is. If this is indeed an "actuality" please settle it. I've read enough of you, Pinnock, and Sanders vs. Piper, Ware, White, Mohler, and the ETS to realize that the only thing being accomplished is both sides digging deeper into their convictions and getting no where. Let us preserve the worldview of God as "holy, holy, holy."
And the four living creatures, each one of them having six wings, are full of eyes around and within; and day and night they do not cease to say, "HOLY, HOLY, HOLY is THE LORD GOD, THE ALMIGHTY, WHO WAS AND WHO IS AND WHO IS TO COME." And when the living creatures give glory and honor and thanks to Him who sits on the throne, to Him who lives forever and ever, the twenty-four elders will fall down before Him who sits on the throne, and will worship Him who lives forever and ever, and will cast their crowns before the throne, saying, "Worthy are You, our Lord and our God, to receive glory and honor and power; for You created all things, and because of Your will they existed, and were created."
Revelation 4:8-11
"To confess that God exists, and at the same time to deny that He has foreknowledge of future things, is the most manifest folly."
Augustine | | Back to Top | | |
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Truth Aficionado
Registered Member
Date Joined Dec 2003
Total Posts : 1544
| Posted 12/28/2004 4:11 AM (GMT -6) | | quote:
Originally posted by cpoteet
I challenge you Dr. Boyd to save God. Bring Him back to who He is.
Whew, the smell of such irony in making accusations of those of OV an LFW persuasion.
Accusing man of stripping the sovereign God of his Glory and then to turn and ask a mere finite man to save God.
Hmmm, is this a quest to save God? Does someone have the shoe slipper on the wrong foot?
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trosie
Registered Member
Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 550
| Posted 12/29/2004 12:42 AM (GMT -6) | | cpoteet,
Does it really matter whether one believes that God knows all the future as definites or if God knows ALL of the possibilities that the future holds based on freewill agents decisions?
The OV doesn't give God any less glory. Indeed, with respect for God's holiness the OV praises the wonder of a God that can work amidst the mess that freewill beings create. "God is working ALL things out for the good for those who love Him" God is working within our free choices.
I don't understand the earnestness in which you write. There is a genuine passion and zealousness in your words but I am wondering if you need be so concerned? Does it really matter to the faith whether a person believes the future is partly open? Personally I think in the scheme of things Satan loves when we get caught up in a concern like this because it prevents us from focusing on other areas.
God bless you always. Thank you for your passionate heart for God's holiness.
trosie | | Back to Top | | |
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1Heart
Registered Member
Date Joined Feb 2004
Total Posts : 1128
| Posted 12/29/2004 12:24 PM (GMT -6) | | quote:
Originally posted by cpoteet
quote:
Originally posted by sparknheart
quote:
Originally posted by cpoteet
I challenge you Dr. Boyd to save God. Bring Him back to who He is.
Whew, the smell of such irony in making accusations of those of OV an LFW persuasion.
Accusing man of stripping the sovereign God of his Glory and then to turn and ask a mere finite man to save God.
Hmmm, is this a quest to save God? Does someone have the shoe slipper on the wrong foot?
You have a great point, and I struggled with whether I should post using that very framework. I decided to do so in a figurative and not a literal sense.
But yes, you are correct that if taken literally it would've been wrong to say.
I sincerely hope that you will have peace with this. God is who He is, regardless of how we see, or present Him. He is holy, and sovereign. It's just that those terms have more meaning for me - a broader meaning than they did before. He is infinitely more sovereign than what I thought several years ago. He is infinitely creative, and intelligent, and compassionate. The open view enhances those characteristics. It does not detract from them. Jesus is the perfect picture of the Father - the imprint of the Father. I look at Him, and see the Father.
Nothing can change God's holiness. This view certainly doesn't. It is the same sacrifice, the same gift, and the same result: lives called, and set apart for Him.
God Bless You,
Jo-Anne
"Sometimes all we can do is go back to the character of God, and drop anchor there."
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GregBoyd
Registered Member
Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 1818
| Posted 12/31/2004 11:02 PM (GMT -6) | | I feel strongly that God is in danger, and I sought out whatever means possible to save Him.
Greg: I thought God was already saved.
But I have seen the folly of my ways, I must not contradict myself in that I believe God is completely sovereign (in that He has planned the ends as well as the means) and trust that He will work in this arena.
Greg: If you believe God controls every thing you think and do and write, and everything I think and do and write -- well then, there isn't much to talk about, is there?
I challenge you Dr. Boyd to save God.
Greg: Again, I didn't know God needed to be saved. I suspect he can pretty much handle himself.
Bring Him back to who He is.
Greg: I think he's already there.
If this is indeed an "actuality" please settle it. I've read enough of you, Pinnock, and Sanders vs. Piper, Ware, White, Mohler, and the ETS to realize that the only thing being accomplished is both sides digging deeper into their convictions and getting no where. Let us preserve the worldview of God as "holy, holy, holy."
Greg: Yes, let us.
And the four living creatures, each one of them having six wings, are full of eyes around and within; and day and night they do not cease to say, "HOLY, HOLY, HOLY is THE LORD GOD, THE ALMIGHTY, WHO WAS AND WHO IS AND WHO IS TO COME." And when the living creatures give glory and honor and thanks to Him who sits on the throne, to Him who lives forever and ever, the twenty-four elders will fall down before Him who sits on the throne, and will worship Him who lives forever and ever, and will cast their crowns before the throne, saying, "Worthy are You, our Lord and our God, to receive glory and honor and power; for You created all things, and because of Your will they existed, and were created."
Greg: Amen.
"The responsibility is with the chooser -- God is blameless." Plato, Republic, 10. | | Back to Top | | |
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