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PotOnWheel
Registered Member
Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 9890
| Posted 1/10/2005 7:59 PM (GMT -6) |   | | Why does "100%" settled have to be "the" issue? Isn't that taking our eyes off of God?
Take, for instance, the relationship of "facts" to "truth." They aren't the same thing. "Facts" can be our perceptions of something. Truth is much bigger and deeper. Think of imbedded reporters in Iraq. They had facts, but only one perspective.
So. . . Go back to your group if the group is about more than percent-settled -- of whatever number. Or, if that was all it ever was (hope not) then find something deeper!
The Heidelberger said...
LORD'S DAY 9
26 Q. What do you believe when you say,
"I believe in God, the Father almighty,
creator of heaven and earth"?
A. That the eternal Father of our Lord Jesus Christ,
who out of nothing created heaven and earth
and everything in them,
who still upholds and rules them
by his eternal counsel and providence,
is my God and Father
because of Christ his Son.
I trust him so much that I do not doubt
he will provide
whatever I need
for body and soul,
and he will turn to my good
whatever adversity he sends me
in this sad world.
He is able to do this because he is almighty God;
he desires to do this because he is a faithful Father.
Praying for you.
"We are free not because we can choose, but only when we have chosen well." - Hart | | Back to Top | | |
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Questioning
Registered Member
Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 37
| Posted 1/11/2005 7:30 PM (GMT -6) | |
Swede said...
Why does "100%" settled have to be "the" issue? Isn't that taking our eyes off of God?
Take, for instance, the relationship of "facts" to "truth." They aren't the same thing. "Facts" can be our perceptions of something. Truth is much bigger and deeper. Think of imbedded reporters in Iraq. They had facts, but only one perspective.
So. . . Go back to your group if the group is about more than percent-settled -- of whatever number. Or, if that was all it ever was (hope not) then find something deeper!
The Heidelberger said...
LORD'S DAY 9
26 Q. What do you believe when you say,
"I believe in God, the Father almighty,
creator of heaven and earth"?
A. That the eternal Father of our Lord Jesus Christ,
who out of nothing created heaven and earth
and everything in them,
who still upholds and rules them
by his eternal counsel and providence,
is my God and Father
because of Christ his Son.
I trust him so much that I do not doubt
he will provide
whatever I need
for body and soul,
and he will turn to my good
whatever adversity he sends me
in this sad world.
He is able to do this because he is almighty God;
he desires to do this because he is a faithful Father.
Swede,
The whole situation hurts. The leader holds to inerrancy. According to him not believing that the future is 100% settled leads to inerrancy falling apart. I was even told that Sanders was almost kicked out of the ETS! I do understand why he holds his position but I do not agree with it.
Since your the only person who has replied it seems as if most folks have not had this type of experience. That is a good thing.
Thanks for your prayers.
Some people are like cement. All mixed up and permanently set. | | Back to Top | | |
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JEE
Registered Member
Date Joined Jul 2004
Total Posts : 1466
| Posted 1/11/2005 8:44 PM (GMT -6) | |
Hi Questioning,
I think many of us can relate to your experience. In my case, my senior pastor expressly forbad me from teaching the Open View in the adult Bible class that I had led for over two years.  (This was only after he had been basically completely dumbfounded and unable to offer a coherent response in several private discussions, always initiated by him, that he and I had had about the Open View).
So I held my peace, and continued teaching that prayer changes things, that we could make a real difference, and personal moral responsibility (all of which claimed he agreed with), and just didn't really get into the status of the future per se.
Now, over two years later, he is at least not as stridently opposed to the Open View, though I don't ever push it with him. It is kind of funny to me how so many will try to affirm that prayer changes things, etc., and yet get really upset when you point out that this has to mean the future is to some extent open, and that God knows it as such.
If I were you, though, judging by the way you describe the leader, I wouldn't try to make a big deal out of it with him any more, and would simply try to find somewhere else to fellowship. (Not saying that's always easy to do emotionally).
John
May the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit.
JohnE
http://revivaltheology.netPost Edited (JEE) : 1/11/2005 8:06:59 PM (GMT-6) | | Back to Top | | |
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Violin for God
Luke, I am your father. --Nooooooooo!!!!!
Date Joined Dec 2004
Total Posts : 690
| Posted 1/12/2005 7:03 PM (GMT -6) | | Hi Questioning,
I haven't yet been kicked out of anything for holding to the Open Theism view, but I've had a couple of discussions with people about this... some agree, some don't, one discussion got really heated. The one that got really heated was probably because of how the idea of the settled future view (SFV) has been used as almost a security blanket... the person I talked with was single and had been believing (probably for a very long time) that God has one specific person planned for him (for who to marry), and he's still getting older and is still waiting. In a lot of ways, the OFV is difficult for many people because to accept it would require a Gestalt shift for them... something most people don't want to do because of how extremely uncomfortable it would be.... having to let go of the security blanket, though it's the security blanket that is negatively affecting their lives. (Looking back, when I briefly believed in the SFV I did a lot of stupid things, but I had no fear. Hey, God was using me for things in church... why would He let any bad thing happen to me. Thank God nothing bad actually happened.)
When I talk with people about the OFV, I usually try to state it in a way that wouldn't jolt their world. More resistance happens that way, and they'd be less willing to hear my point. However, I may not be able to get quite an accurate picture across to them right away... I figure there'll probably be other chances to get into more detail if they're interested. Most people don't know I hold to the OFV. It's not worth it to throw away friendships in that manner if I can help it. I'd rather "agree to disagree" with fellow Christians than to have a split over an issue that is not fundamental to the faith. The fundamental issue is who the Lord is, who we are, and how to make right the wrongs/sins.
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