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| Open Theism Discussion Board > Public Forums > The raging debate continues here... > Ways in which God can know the future. | Forum Quick Jump
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Laika
Registered Member
Date Joined Mar 2003
Total Posts : 2433
| Posted 5/12/2005 4:22 PM (GMT -6) |   |
Hunter said...
It seems like your arguments all fall on God knowing what He is going to do. How can He say what He will do, and what it will cause if He does not know what others will do that could potentially mess it up (if he did not have EDF)? By Isaiah 41:23 he would then cease to be God (or a god...) because he would no longer "declare the things that are going to come afterward".
Because the verses presented that purport to show God's passive knowlege of the future almost always actually show God declaring what He's going to do in the future. And/or are really general in nature. "Nation will war against nation", e.g.
Looking at the context of Isaiah 41, God is subduing Israel's enemies v 2, chose Abraham, Isaac and Jacob v8, works/fights for them v9-16, calls Himself the King of Jacob v21, what "things"/events do you think He's talking about in v22-26? The same "things" He's being talking about prior to v22-26, Israel and His dealings with them.
He knows what He's done for Israel and has reminded them of and what He's going to do for Israel. Let another "god" declare what He's done for Israel and what He's going to do, that's His challenge.
I think, taken in context, He's continuing to talk about His dealings with and plan for Isreal; I don't think He's switched to talking about, say, will there be a long wall built in China someday or would a loser of a team called the New York Mets ever win the distinctly American game called, inappropriately, the "World" Series.
Occam's Razor says, don't unecessarily choose the most difficult answer when a simpler one will suffice.
Thanks for the kudos, I actually passed 2000 posts way back when I had multiple login names...... heh heh heh.
 Post Edited (Laika) : 5/12/2005 4:26:17 PM (GMT-5) | | Back to Top | | |
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Hunter
Registered Member
Date Joined May 2005
Total Posts : 11
| Posted 5/12/2005 5:06 PM (GMT -6) | | Laika said...
I think, taken in context, He's continuing to talk about His dealings with and plan for Isreal; I don't think He's switched to talking about, say, will there be a long wall built in China someday or would a loser of a team called the New York Mets ever win the distinctly American game called, inappropriately, the "World" Series.
(Haha.)
Whether he is talking about His plans for Israel or not, that is an example of foreknowledge.
The Bible does not address everything from the Great Wall to the World Series though, and so of course you won't find these things in here, but neither does this verse claim to be only about what God has planned for Israel. Your argument goes both ways.
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Once again, what about 1 Peter? | | Back to Top | | |
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Laika
Registered Member
Date Joined Mar 2003
Total Posts : 2433
| Posted 5/12/2005 5:28 PM (GMT -6) | |
Hunter said...
Laika said...
I think, taken in context, He's continuing to talk about His dealings with and plan for Isreal; I don't think He's switched to talking about, say, will there be a long wall built in China someday or would a loser of a team called the New York Mets ever win the distinctly American game called, inappropriately, the "World" Series. (Haha.) Whether he is talking about His plans for Israel or not, that is an example of foreknowledge. Yes, God is talking about what God is doing in Israel's past, present and future in this passage and He knows what He did, what He's doing and what He will do.
But the topic was "exhaustive fore-knowlege", remember?
1 Peter, God knows that God has contingency plans.
I expect extraordinary proof for extraordinary claims (God knows ALL the future) and I'm not even getting mundane proof.
TGB:
Laika-
I understand. Take a walk out back, kick the dog, fire your gun some. I know. You know I know. You know I know that you know. I know.
huh? wakaranain desu....
TGB, we's got to do a discussion in the haven, I've formulated an argument and I wanna run it by you.
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Laika
Registered Member
Date Joined Mar 2003
Total Posts : 2433
| Posted 5/13/2005 6:44 AM (GMT -6) | |
Hunter said...
TGB: Be patiant. I've never done this before... (not in a forum at least)
Laika: What would you consider extrordinary proof?
トマスさん分かりません。（はい、ぼくはでつちあげるです）:P びっくりした・なぜわらってるのかなー
Post Edited (Laika) : 5/13/2005 7:02:16 AM (GMT-5) | | Back to Top | | |
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