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PotOnWheel
Registered Member
Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 9890
| Posted 7/13/2004 6:17 AM (GMT -6) |   | | Jesus is NOT CREATED. Despite what Arias taught. | | Back to Top | | |
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Truth Aficionado
Registered Member
Date Joined Dec 2003
Total Posts : 1544
| Posted 7/13/2004 6:28 AM (GMT -6) | | quote:
Originally posted by sparknheart
Here is a link POW posted on another topic:LINK.
It appears that the Orthodox Church believes Lucifer was a fallen angel.
quote:
Satan (which means literally the enemy or the adversary) is one proper name for the devil, the leader of the evil spirits. He is identified in the serpent symbol of Gen 3 and as the tempter of both Job and Jesus (Job 1:6; Mk 1:33). He is labelled by Christ as a deceiver and liar, the "father of lies" (Jn 8:44) and the "prince of this world" (Jn 12:31; 14:30; 16:11). He has "fallen from heaven" together with his evil angels to do battle with God and his servants (Lk 10:18; Isa 14:12). It is this same Satan who "entered Judas" to effect the betrayal and destruction of Christ (Lk 22:3).
What do you think POW? | | Back to Top | | |
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PotOnWheel
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Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 9890
| Posted 7/13/2004 8:52 AM (GMT -6) | | Just remember that heaven is not a place, but a condition of being in God's presence... Then that is not only what the EO understands, but the Swedish Baptists (BGC) too.
Is that "late breaking news?" Seems standard knowledge to me.
That's also: Lutheran, Anglican, Roman Catholic, Methodist, Presbyterian, Coptic, Reformed, etc... | | Back to Top | | |
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Truth Aficionado
Registered Member
Date Joined Dec 2003
Total Posts : 1544
| Posted 7/13/2004 9:18 AM (GMT -6) | | quote:
Originally posted by PotOnWheel
Is that "late breaking news?" Seems standard knowledge to me.
Sorry POW,
I'm just a starving young pup, thanks for throwing me a morsel of knowledge.
Seriously, I would like to know how you and the EOC interpret Isa:14. Do you believe the morning star is in reference to the king of Babylon or satan? I have a lot of respect for your opinion and would appreciate your input.
Shalom,
Mark | | Back to Top | | |
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PotOnWheel
Registered Member
Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 9890
| Posted 7/13/2004 10:21 AM (GMT -6) | | Please accept my apology, spark in heart. I'm basically shy. You startled me.
:) | | Back to Top | | |
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PotOnWheel
Registered Member
Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 9890
| Posted 7/13/2004 10:40 AM (GMT -6) | | quote:
Originally posted by sparknheart
quote:
Originally posted by PotOnWheel
Is that "late breaking news?" Seems standard knowledge to me.
Sorry POW,
I'm just a starving young pup, thanks for throwing me a morsel of knowledge.
Seriously, I would like to know how you and the EOC interpret Isa:14. Do you believe the morning star is in reference to the king of Babylon or satan? I have a lot of respect for your opinion and would appreciate your input.
Shalom,
Mark
I think I remember Doc Lewis at Bethel College (MN) implying that it could be both. Since scripture kinda gets revealed more as time goes on, the literal interpretation can also have spiritual interpretations. I know that practice gets bad press now days, but interwoven in what we all know about OT scripture and how it all turned out, we shouldn't deny it. And Origin of Alexandria (part of who's bad press is connected to what was done with similar ideas later, and who's sole condemnation was for teaching pre-existence of souls) held scripture so very close to his heart. For him it was not a game or a puzzle, or a mind-exercise: it was finding "Christ according the the scriptures" as much as for Irenaeus. Back to the topic...  I'm no expert here. I think I've heard all of these. Except the "morning stars" held a possitive implication.
I have heard said, wisely, that no matter what bad roles Satan might perform, God is still in control. When God uses him to some end, it may be inspite of himself, but God still accomplishes his ends.
We sometimes think that everything should be rosey. But this is a nasty fallen world. Everything ends in death. The hardships must be interpreted in respect to the "end" (alla Pannenberg). Who is to say that someone doesn't need a big kick in the side to achieve humility enough to not be his own God. And who is to say that those in Calcutta didn't provide the reception to Mother Theresa's grace that formed her even more into the likeness of Christ?
Now days we want God to be "P.C." Ain't so. | | Back to Top | | |
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Truth Aficionado
Registered Member
Date Joined Dec 2003
Total Posts : 1544
| Posted 7/13/2004 11:06 AM (GMT -6) | | quote:
Originally posted by PotOnWheel
We sometimes think that everything should be rosey. But this is a nasty fallen world. Everything ends in death. The hardships must be interpreted in respect to the "end" (alla Pannenberg). Who is to say that someone doesn't need a big kick in the side to achieve humility enough to not be his own God. And who is to say that those in Calcutta didn't provide the reception to Mother Theresa's grace that formed her even more into the likeness of Christ?
Now days we want God to be "P.C." Ain't so.
Thanks POW,
I think your right. It sounds like old Lucifer/satan was known to kick even Mother Theresa around on occasion.
www.cnn.com/2001/WORLD/asiapcf/south/09/04/mother.theresa.exorcism/
And here last night I thought it was just my wife kicking me in my sleep. | | Back to Top | | |
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PotOnWheel
Registered Member
Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 9890
| Posted 7/13/2004 11:24 AM (GMT -6) | | quote:
Originally posted by sparknheart
It sounds like old Lucifer/satan was known to kick even Mother Theresa around on occasion.
I don't think I said that (about Mother Theresa).
I'm the one that needs kicks. | | Back to Top | | |
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PotOnWheel
Registered Member
Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 9890
| Posted 7/13/2004 11:55 AM (GMT -6) | | | | |
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barryatk
Registered Member
Date Joined Jun 2004
Total Posts : 101
| Posted 7/13/2004 1:52 PM (GMT -6) | | Scott Said:
For the record, I would like to make clear (in case there are those who haven't come to know me through my previous postings) that I am a Christian, a believer in the historical life, death, and literal resurrection of Jesus of Nazareth, who was in some way uniquely both God and human, and by whose self-sacrifice we are in some way saved. I am not, however, a conservative evangelical or fundamentalist Christian, since I have come to conclude over the years that many of the distinctive doctrines of those Christian sub-cultures lack sufficient biblical warrant in the final analysis. For example, I do not believe in the necessity or reality of total biblical inerrancy and full verbal plenary inspiration; I am a theistic evolutionist; an inclusivist; and an eschatological idealist and amillenialist. But neither am I a genuine Christian liberal and I reject such characteristic liberal views as universalism, religious pluralism, and denial of the literal resurrection; nor am I a philosophical "skeptic", agnostic, materialist or what-have-you.end
Barryatk:
Intrigued by your mix up there.
Until the last couple years I was quite the fundamentalist, I'd say.
Now, I do think all the VITAL truths are there at face value for the honest seeker..I mean in the Bible. I once tried to explain to a loved one that the things Job said are not "The inspired words of God" and the argument never ended. I recoil when I hear ministers at funerals say God Took Them. They're refering to Job.
Anyway, I am heartily convinced that the standard doctrine as satan being a created angel (also called lucifer), a leader of rebellion in heaven, a living but illicite creature today(See Colossians),and doomed to eternal torment(see Rev.). Here are my struggles:
1. Is He at God's beck and call?
2. Does he know what's in my inmost heart?
3. How much of my attention should be on him in fighting his designs?
Favorite authors on this:
Derek Prince, JP Jackson, Francic Frangipane
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