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Tigress
Registered Member
Date Joined Feb 2003
Total Posts : 1252
| Posted 2/24/2003 10:29 AM (GMT -6) |   | I have a few random questions regarding some current fairly common practices and I think they fall under the spiritual warfare category, but I'm not sure.
1. Wouldn't hypnosis be considered a "work of the devil" in that it requires a person to give up power of their mind to the hypnotist to influence it however the hypnotist wanted? It seems like a form of magic or demonic power that the Bible clearly forbids.
2. I have a Christian friend who recently started dating a Christian guy who's brother does acupuncture on him. The guy and his brother are the sons of a pastor, too. Isn't acupunture an occultic practice because they use powerful influences that are not of God?
3. Whenever I hear about how people who's children have been kidnapped and they use the services of a psychic, I wonder if that's really something that God would approve of. Isn't going to a psychic to find a lost child or a murderer the same thing as going to a psychic to have your fortune told? Getting your fortune told is clearly forbidden in the Bible?
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Iconoclast
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Date Joined Oct 2001
Total Posts : 1227
| Posted 2/24/2003 5:27 PM (GMT -6) | | Tigress
1. Wouldn't hypnosis be considered a "work of the devil" in that it requires a person to give up power of their mind to the hypnotist to influence it however the hypnotist wanted? It seems like a form of magic or demonic power that the Bible clearly forbids.
Iconoclast
This is a misunderstanding of hypnotic techniques. People enter trance states all day long (driving a car often induces trance states). Noticing when a person is in a trance state and delivering a healing, positive message to them is a loving thing to do. For example, when reading a bed-time story to your child try and notice when they are most in a trance state and then whisper in their ear "Mommy and Daddy just love you."
Also, if hypnotic techniques are used to cure someone of a life-long phobia isn't that a good thing? If it is a good thing then how can it be demonic power - else Satan's house is divided against itself.
Mat 12:22 Then a blind and dumb demoniac was brought to him, and he healed him, so that the dumb man spoke and saw.
Mat 12:23 And all the people were amazed, and said, "Can this be the Son of David?"
Mat 12:24 But when the Pharisees heard it they said, "It is only by Be-el'zebul, the prince of demons, that this man casts out demons."
Mat 12:25 Knowing their thoughts, he said to them, "Every kingdom divided against itself is laid waste, and no city or house divided against itself will stand;
Mat 12:26 and if Satan casts out Satan, he is divided against himself; how then will his kingdom stand?
Mat 12:27 And if I cast out demons by Be-el'zebul, by whom do your sons cast them out? Therefore they shall be your judges.
Mat 12:28 But if it is by the Spirit of God that I cast out demons, then the kingdom of God has come upon you.
Mat 12:29 Or how can one enter a strong man's house and plunder his goods, unless he first binds the strong man? Then indeed he may plunder his house.
thanks,
Iconoclast
"The benefit overran the merit the first day, and has overrun the merit ever since. The merit itself, so-called, I reckon part of the receiving." - Ralph Waldo Emerson | | Back to Top | | |
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Iconoclast
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Date Joined Oct 2001
Total Posts : 1227
| Posted 2/24/2003 5:31 PM (GMT -6) | | Tigress
2. I have a Christian friend who recently started dating a Christian guy who's brother does acupuncture on him. The guy and his brother are the sons of a pastor, too. Isn't acupunture an occultic practice because they use powerful influences that are not of God?
Iconoclast
I don't know much about acupuncture but what is the evidence that is some power that is not of God? Is open-heart surgery a powerful influence that is not of God? Does acupuncture heal or harm?
thanks,
Iconoclast
"The benefit overran the merit the first day, and has overrun the merit ever since. The merit itself, so-called, I reckon part of the receiving." - Ralph Waldo Emerson | | Back to Top | | |
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Iconoclast
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Date Joined Oct 2001
Total Posts : 1227
| Posted 2/24/2003 5:33 PM (GMT -6) | | Tigress
3. Whenever I hear about how people who's children have been kidnapped and they use the services of a psychic, I wonder if that's really something that God would approve of. Isn't going to a psychic to find a lost child or a murderer the same thing as going to a psychic to have your fortune told? Getting your fortune told is clearly forbidden in the Bible?
Iconoclast
If I went to a psychic and that psychic found my lost child or gave information that stopped a murder from happening then why wouldn't I interpret it that they were given "a word of knowledge" from the Holy Spirit?
thanks,
Iconoclast
"The benefit overran the merit the first day, and has overrun the merit ever since. The merit itself, so-called, I reckon part of the receiving." - Ralph Waldo Emerson | | Back to Top | | |
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Springs
Registered Member
Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 636
| Posted 2/24/2003 6:23 PM (GMT -6) | | Great Questions Tigress. Sorry I can't be more thorough here, just a few thoughts.
1. Like all true things hypnosis can be distorted. It is a totally relaxed state of mind. We can hypnotize ourselves or move into a trance state like Icon said. It has beneficial uses, but it can also be abused. A hypnotized person does not give up control of their soul, or mind, they get in touch with it. I suppose a Satanist could use hypnosis to do harm, but the subject would have to be a willing participant.
2. Acupuncture can be merely a physical treatment for ailments employed by a pastor’s son to relieve someone of suffering. Or it can be employed by those involved in the occult for “religious” purposes that may sooth the body, but endanger the soul.
3. I think God had good reason to forbid us from enquiring of psychics. If it’s a word of knowledge that someone is looking for the Holy Spirit is still able. A Christian friend of mine found the kidnappers of his child and effected rescue, by entering into fervent prayer and following the Lord’s lead into the underbelly of a huge city, to the very place they were.
Springs
Thy love did read by rote and could not spell. - Friar Laurence. - Shakespeare | | Back to Top | | |
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shell
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Date Joined Mar 2002
Total Posts : 280
| Posted 2/25/2003 4:39 AM (GMT -6) | | Tigress:
quote:
2. I have a Christian friend who recently started dating a Christian guy who's brother does acupuncture on him. The guy and his brother are the sons of a pastor, too. Isn't acupunture an occultic practice because they use powerful influences that are not of God?
Shell: Those are good questions. I think it is a mistake of well meaning Christians to assume that anything that is outside of western medical practices is occultic. I do believe that it is possible that some do bring that into alternative practices but that is a matter of descernment. I have a daughter who has medical issues that have not been helped by traditional western medicine, which is often just prescribing some sort of medication(many times with harmful side affects) and treating symptoms rather than treating the underlying issues. We have gotten life changing help from alternative medicine. We always pray before we embark on something, and ask for wisdom and protection and that God will lead us in the right direction. And yes we have run into things that we know God would have us steer clear of...and He has made that clear.
I just think it is arrogant of our western culture to think that traditional medicine is the only way to go. I think there is so much we don't undrstand about our bodies, and that we are much more intricately designed by God than traditional medicine often allows for.
As far as acupuncture goes, I know of a wonderful Chrisitan lady who does acupuncture and has helped hundreds with excruciating pain that had no response to traditional medical intervention. She prays with her clients and glorifies the Lord through her work.
Shell
Edited by - shell on 02/25/2003 09:39:59 AM | | Back to Top | | |
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Tigress
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Date Joined Feb 2003
Total Posts : 1252
| Posted 2/25/2003 5:29 AM (GMT -6) | | In regards to acupunture, I know it's an Asian practice and I was just wondering if it was similar to the martial arts which often involve praying to false gods and drawing power from them and mystical sources that are not of God. I have a Japanese American friend who used to be Buddhist and who used to practice martial arts and after she and her mom became Christians they realized that they shouldn't do martial arts anymore because of its glorification of false gods and demonic powers.
In regards to psychic powers - those powers are given by Satan who disquises himself as an angel of light and therefore will try to get people to believe they are doing a good thing while still using his powers which are ALWAYS contrary to God and His Will. Satan will try to do good in small ways in order to get people to continue practicing the sins that made a positive thing happen. Even if a murdered is caught through a pschyic's efforts, the means that were used to catch the murdered were through Satan's powers which are ALWAYS against God and His Will. If you love God, you won't be aligned with Satan in anything.
Tigress
The Angel of the Lord encamps around those who fear Him, and He delivers them.
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Tigress
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Date Joined Feb 2003
Total Posts : 1252
| Posted 2/25/2003 5:46 AM (GMT -6) | | Oops! Here I meant to write, "Even if a murderer is caught..." and not murdered.
[Even if a murdered is caught through a pschyic's efforts, the means that were used to catch the murdered were through Satan's powers which are ALWAYS against God and His Will. If you love God, you won't be aligned with Satan in anything.]
Tigress
The Angel of the Lord encamps around those who fear Him, and He delivers them.
-Psalm 34:7 | | Back to Top | | |
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shell
Registered Member
Date Joined Mar 2002
Total Posts : 280
| Posted 2/25/2003 7:18 AM (GMT -6) | | quote:
In regards to acupunture, I know it's an Asian practice and I was just wondering if it was similar to the martial arts which often involve praying to false gods and drawing power from them and mystical sources that are not of God. I have a Japanese American friend who used to be Buddhist and who used to practice martial arts and after she and her mom became Christians they realized that they shouldn't do martial arts anymore because of its glorification of false gods and demonic powers.
Shell: Then the answer to your question is no, not always. I would say the same about martial arts or tae kwondo(sp?) It can't always be categorized with worshipping false Gods. I have christian friends who practice all of the arts you mentioned and pray and get strenth from the Lord.
Edited by - shell on 02/25/2003 12:19:12 PM | | Back to Top | | |
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Tigress
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Date Joined Feb 2003
Total Posts : 1252
| Posted 2/26/2003 11:56 AM (GMT -6) | | Shell wrote:
["Shell: Then the answer to your question is no, not always. I would say the same about martial arts or tae kwondo(sp?) It can't always be categorized with worshipping false Gods. I have christian friends who practice all of the arts you mentioned and pray and get strenth from the Lord."]
But just because they do, doesn't mean that the practice itself isn't occultic. God may have chosen to bring good out of that sin in that one instance, but that doesn't excuse people from continuing to do that sin always.
Tigress
The Angel of the Lord encamps around those who fear Him, and He delivers them.
-Psalm 34:7 | | Back to Top | | |
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BJS
Registered Member
Date Joined Dec 2001
Total Posts : 587
| Posted 2/26/2003 12:03 PM (GMT -6) | | Are you saying that karate is sinful, Tigress?
Brett
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Tigress
Registered Member
Date Joined Feb 2003
Total Posts : 1252
| Posted 2/27/2003 10:39 AM (GMT -6) | | Brett wrote:
["Are you saying that karate is sinful, Tigress?"]
No. I'm saying that anything that's even remotely connected to Satan and his evil works is something that Christians should have no part of. I have a Christian friend who practices martial arts without any of the Asian pagan religious rituals attached to them. So what he does is fine, because he doesn't do any of the stuff that pagans would do during it.
If Christians are doing something that's traditionally pagan, they need to sever all pagan aspects of it from what they're doing. Some pagan/occultic stuff is so ingrained in a particular practice, it cannot be severed. I was just wondering if that might have been the case with acupuncture.
Please note that I'm substituting the word pagan for non-Christian Asian religions, because I'm not sure which religions are affiliated with the various martial arts. Karate is from Japan and would be one of that nation's religions. Tai Kwon Do is from another Asian country, I think. Judo if from another, etc.
Tigress
The Angel of the Lord encamps around those who fear Him, and He delivers them.
-Psalm 34:7 | | Back to Top | | |
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Tigress
Registered Member
Date Joined Feb 2003
Total Posts : 1252
| Posted 2/27/2003 10:40 AM (GMT -6) | | Also, I know for a fact that in Sumo wrestling, the two wrestlers must pray/give homage to certain false gods before entering the ring and beginning their fight. I know that other forms of martial arts do similar things.
Tigress
The Angel of the Lord encamps around those who fear Him, and He delivers them.
-Psalm 34:7 | | Back to Top | | |
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Triskal
Registered Member
Date Joined Jul 2001
Total Posts : 198
| Posted 3/13/2003 9:28 AM (GMT -6) | | quote:
In regards to acupunture, I know it's an Asian practice and I was just wondering if it was similar to the martial arts which often involve praying to false gods and drawing power from them and mystical sources that are not of God. I have a Japanese American friend who used to be Buddhist and who used to practice martial arts and after she and her mom became Christians they realized that they shouldn't do martial arts anymore because of its glorification of false gods and demonic powers.
Tigress,
I've been practicing several forms of Martial Arts for over 8 years now. I hold the rank of 1st Degree Black Belt in Tae Kwon Do, as well as in Hap Kido. I'm also an assistant instructor of both of those Martial Arts at a local community center. I an assure you that there are MANY forms of Martial Arts that do not involve "praying to false Gods". In fact, I have never even heard of such a thing. There are a few forms of Kung Fu which involve meditation, but that is very rarely practiced here in the states. And if it is, it's nothing more than mere relaxation techniques.
Martials Arts are not evil, and certainly not destructive or harmful to anyone. On the contrary, I believe they are an effective way of getting in shape, as well as learning to better defend yourself and those around you. We teach that Martial Arts are not to be used as offensive, but as defensive. We teach that to redirect a persons violent force away from yourself and from them is a loving way of bringing control to a harmful situation.
Let me pose a question to you: If you were walking out to the parking lot of a mall with a friend or loved one, and someone attacked you from out of nowhere, what would you do? The Bible does teach us to turn the other cheek, but what if others are involved? If there were things you could learn to better defend yourself and those around you from such a situation, wouldn't it be right to use them? Not only do Tae Kwon Do and Hap Kido teach people to defend themselves and others, but they teach you how to take the control of a situation away from an attacker--which, in the end, is better for the attacker as well.
Just some things to consider. 
- Matt -
"In Him we live and move and have our being" - Acts 17:28
"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." Edward Burke | | Back to Top | | |
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Tigress
Registered Member
Date Joined Feb 2003
Total Posts : 1252
| Posted 3/13/2003 11:21 AM (GMT -6) | | Triskal,
Thank you for your insights. It's good to hear from someone "in the know." I agree that any martial arts that are completely severed from the occult are perfectly fine to practice. And even though I don't know any martial arts myself, I wouldn't hesitate to kick the crap out of an attacker in whatever way I could. I remember in a high school assembly a police officer described to all us teens how to put out the eyes of an attacker if he's on top of you. To literally push them out of their sockets. It would be pretty grewsome, but hey - he's got no right to violate anyone.
My whole point about occultic influences is that they should be completely severed from anything you're doing, and if those influences are too intrinsically connected to whatever that is, then it is off-limits to Christians who can only serve one master - Jesus.
Tigress
The Angel of the Lord encamps around those who fear Him, and He delivers them.
-Psalm 34:7 | | Back to Top | | |
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