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Truth Aficionado
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Posted 7/20/2004 5:35 AM (GMT -6)

What is "Dark Night of the Soul? Below is a link for some interesting reading.
"He soars on the wings of Divine love . . ."

Contradictions if well understood and managed can spark off the fires of invention. Orthodoxy whether of the right or of the left is the graveyard of creativity.

Post Edited (sparknheart) : 7/18/2005 8:47:26 AM (GMT-5)

PotOnWheel
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Posted 7/20/2004 6:11 AM (GMT -6)

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doctor_of_the_Church

Sisters of Cain
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Posted 7/20/2004 6:32 AM (GMT -6)

quote:
Originally posted by PotOnWheel

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doctor_of_the_Church

Hey, PoWy, ever heard of the Ecstasy of Saint Theresa?

What is it?

Truth Aficionado
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Posted 7/20/2004 6:59 AM (GMT -6)

quote:
Originally posted by Sisters of Cain
Hey, PoWy, ever heard of the Ecstasy of Saint Theresa?

What is it?

Ecstasy of St. Teresa Click here for link.

"Beside me on the left appeared an angel in bodily form . . . He was not tall but short, and very beautiful; and his face was so aflame that he appeared to be one of the highest ranks of angels, who seem to be all on fire . . . In his hands I saw a great golden spear, and at the iron tip there appeared to be a point of fire. This he plunged into my heart several times so that it penetrated my entrails. When he pulled it out I felt that he took them with it, and left me utterly consumed by the great love of God. The pain was so severe that it made me utter several moans. The sweetness caused by this intense pain is so extreme that one can not possibly wish it to cease, nor is one's soul content with anything but God. This is not a physical but a spiritual pain, though the body has some share in it -- even a considerable share."

Truth Aficionado
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Posted 7/20/2004 7:13 AM (GMT -6)

My self-righteous judgment towards my fellow brother’s sin is the devil’s great distracter of my own sin, my sin that seeks to elude me. The sin of man glares out to me with such clarity while my own sin takes refuge in the dark shadows of my soul? God have mercy, Christ have mercy.

The devil’s diversion tactics leaves me searching outside of myself, a substitute for looking into the darkness of my own soul. I trust in our Lord God as I surrender all of myself and repent of the judgment that insults the very blood of Jesus’ righteousness that I wear. Lord have mercy, Christ have mercy.

Truth Aficionado
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Posted 7/20/2004 7:21 AM (GMT -6)

"Alone you stood before God when he called you; alone you had to answer that call; alone you had to struggle and pray; and alone you will die and give an account to God." -Life Together, Dietrich Bonhoeffer.

selah
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Posted 7/20/2004 7:49 AM (GMT -6)

So much to say...so little time. First of all, one minor correction...as I recall, it was the ecstasy of St. Teresa of Avila (no H) a carmelite. Not to be confused with St Therese of Lisieux (the little flower) also a Carmelite.

St John of the cross...also a Carmelite.

In my opinion, the writings of/and about these saints really make for some very good reading. So much so, one could even end up late for appointments and stuff like that. Be careful! Smile

Carmelites Rule! Last year I almost became a nun in the lay Carmelite order... (these nuns can marry...nice perk)...
love
selah

"When we acknowledge that all of life is sacred and that each act is an act of choice and therefore sacred, then life is a sacred dance lived consciously each moment. When we live at this level, we participate in the creation of a better world."

Scout Cloud Lee

Sisters of Cain
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Posted 7/20/2004 8:11 AM (GMT -6)

quote:
Originally posted by Selah

So much to say...so little time. First of all, one minor correction...as I recall, it was the ecstasy of St. Teresa of Avila (no H) a carmelite. Not to be confused with St Therese of Lisieux (the little flower) also a Carmelite.

There's two of them? O.K.
There's a czech or slovak band named after one of them. Whichever had the ecstasy...

quote:

Carmelites Rule!

Carmel Rolls Rule, too!

PotOnWheel
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Posted 7/20/2004 8:27 AM (GMT -6)

I like St. John of the Ladder instead. (St. John Climacus)

A series of clickable links begins at http://www.innerlightproductions.com/thoughts/sept2699.htm

PotOnWheel
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Posted 7/20/2004 8:30 AM (GMT -6)

St John of the Ladder:
When so many Rungs make a Rite

Truth Aficionado
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Posted 7/20/2004 8:41 AM (GMT -6)

quote:
Originally posted by Selah

So much to say...so little time. First of all, one minor correction...as I recall, it was the ecstasy of St. Teresa of Avila (no H) a carmelite. Not to be confused with St Therese of Lisieux (the little flower) also a Carmelite.

Thank you Selah, you are so right.
So I got the "H" outa there.

Sisters of Cain
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Posted 7/20/2004 8:43 AM (GMT -6)

quote:
Originally posted by PotOnWheel

I like St. John of the Ladder instead. (St. John Climacus)

He climbed the ladder to climacus?

LOL

Now there's a euphemism !

Tom
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Posted 7/20/2004 9:12 AM (GMT -6)

Sisters: He climbed the ladder to climacus?

Tom: No, he climacus to ecstasy!

Blush

Sisters of Cain
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Posted 7/20/2004 9:15 AM (GMT -6)

quote:
Originally posted by TGB

Sisters: He climbed the ladder to climacus?

Tom: No, he climacus to ecstasy!

PoWy's gonna go inquisition on us now. Knife

Truth Aficionado
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Posted 7/20/2004 9:16 AM (GMT -6)

quote:
Originally posted by PotOnWheel

St John of the Ladder:
When so many Rungs make a Rite

LOL

Oh yes, are we to be grateful to St. John the Ladder for giving us the list of the Seven Deadly Sins? Sad

Sisters of Cain
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Total Posts : 431

Posted 7/20/2004 9:24 AM (GMT -6)

quote:
Originally posted by sparknheart

quote:
Originally posted by PotOnWheel

St John of the Ladder:
When so many Rungs make a Rite

LOL

Oh yes, are we to be grateful to St. John the Ladder for giving us the list of the Seven Deadly Sins?

ARTIST: Alan Jay Lerner and Frederick Loewe
TITLE: The Seven Deadly Virtues
Lyrics

[From Camelot]

The seven deadly virtues, those ghastly little traps
Oh no, my liege, they were not meant for me
Those seven deadly virtues were made for other chaps
Who love a life of failure and ennui

Take courage - now there's a sport
An invitation to the state of rigor mort
And purity - a noble yen
And very restful every now and then
I find humility means to be hurt
It's not the earth the meek inherit, it's the dirt
Honesty is fatal, it should be taboo
Diligence - a fate I would hate
If charity means giving, I give it to you
And fidelity is only for your mate

You'll never find a virtue unstatusing my quo
Or making my Beelzebubble burst
Let others take the high road, I will take the low
I cannot wait to rush in where angels fear to go
With all those seven deadly virtues, free and happy little me
Has not been cursed

PotOnWheel
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Total Posts : 9890

Posted 7/20/2004 1:04 PM (GMT -6)

quote:
Originally posted by sparknheart

grateful to St. John the Ladder for giving us the list of the Seven Deadly Sins

No, its older than that. www.idahomonks.org/sect405.htm "St. Benedict was greatly influenced by the monastic writings of Cassian" ... Gregory the Great’s teaching on the seven deadly sins comes from Cassian, as does much of his teaching on compunction and prayer. Cassian’s ideas also were influential in the East, through Greek translations. He influenced John Climacus and John of Damascus.

(Cassian was Western, where they liked the number seven. The East has varying lists and did not try for a "neat" number.)

PotOnWheel
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Posted 7/20/2004 1:32 PM (GMT -6)

quote:
St. John Climacus, who lived back in the 7th century, tells a story that illustrates just how difficult this sin can be to identify. I will leave you with his words. St. John wrote: "An old man, very experienced in these matters, once spiritually admonished a proud brother who said in his blindness: 'Forgive me, father, but I am not proud.' 'My son,' said the wise old man, 'what better proof of your pride could you have given than to claim that you were not proud?'"

Truth Aficionado
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Posted 8/3/2004 5:21 PM (GMT -6)

St. John of the Cross, sixteenth century Roman Catholic
theologian/mystic, and co-founder of the Carmelite Order, used the
phrase "dark night of the soul" to describe the extreme desolation
which epitomized the eighth stage of his ten stages of spiritual
ascent, or, in other words, the depression, isolation, and alienation
which afflicts those seeking spiritual enlightenment just prior to the
dawning of transcendence.

Truth Aficionado
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Posted 8/3/2004 5:41 PM (GMT -6)

"The two books of the Dark Night describe how God purifies the soul passively. The discussion of God's communication is limited to that communication called purgative contemplation. Because this contemplation is dark and painful to the soul it is called a night."

www.helpfellowship.org/St_John_of_the_Cross.htm

John Earp
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Total Posts : 1715

Posted 8/3/2004 6:34 PM (GMT -6)

quote:
Originally posted by sparknheart

"The two books of the Dark Night describe how God purifies the soul passively. The discussion of God's communication is limited to that communication called purgative contemplation. Because this contemplation is dark and painful to the soul it is called a night."

www.helpfellowship.org/St_John_of_the_Cross.htm

John of the Cross' works on the devotional life are classic. It is TOO cool to find out that he was influenced by John Cassian. Cassian, being one of the great semi-Pelagians, is naturally one of my favorites, right up there with Julian Eclanum, Coelestius, and Pelagius himself.

Along with John of the Cross, other "spiritual writers" who have have a profound impact on me are:

Marie Guyon's Experiencing the Depths of Jesus Christ

Brother Lawrence's The Practice of the Presence of God

John Wesley's A Plain Account of Christian Perfection

My only caveat for anyone delving into a study of John of the Cross of any of these others I have listed (besides perhaps Guyon) is to be careful to keep your mind "set on things above." It can be all too easy to fall into morbid introspection and legalism with some of the Catholic writers, in my experience.

"The Discovery of new truth will modify old views and opinions, and there is perhaps no end to this process with finite minds in any world." Charles G. Finney, Systematic Theology.

revivaltheology.net

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